Ryn Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 Hahaha "Cannon." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 1, 2013 Share Posted December 1, 2013 yeah that didn't help their position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 2, 2013 Share Posted December 2, 2013 Pretty awesome mash-up right there. Found it on DeviantArt (DV). Don't surf DV without the mature content filter, unless you want to of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 Just rewatched Day of the Doctor cause the kid hadn't seen it. (he loved it) When we first see the war room on Galifrey, the guy in charge says that the "plans of the high council have failed." SO I think that means, the events with Rassilon and the Master and the taking the planet to Earth has already gone down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 That sets up a nice little sequence then, because it means the 10th Doctor* inadvertently sets up a last ditch scenario for Gallifrey where they are now receptive to The War Doctor's plan. *This new numbering thing will wreck havoc on convos. I have decided to not change. Tennant is the 10th etc. etc. Cool to hear that Oliver enjoyed the special, my kids also loved it. My daughter is attached to Matt Smith, of course she is aware the Doctor changes but she has just never been on board when it happens. I'm interested to see how Smith's departure will hit her, she is quite adamant that the Doctor is him and the other guys are "just whatever!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 3, 2013 Share Posted December 3, 2013 Oliver watched pretty much the full run since the relaunch in the last year, so he's excited for regenerations. He says Matt Smith is his favorite, but knows he's about up. And I think that Tennant will always be the tenth, because he was the tenth actor to play the Doctor. That's how I'm thinking it. The ads for the next episode still call Smith the 11th, so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryn Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Matt Smith's Doctor = Jar Jar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 He's not too far off if you think about it... all elbows and all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue 3 Posted December 15, 2013 Share Posted December 15, 2013 Not sure if you all saw the trailer for the Xmas special, so below is the link to it. The line spoken by the Daleks is interesting! Present at a key moment! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 The regenerating line? Not sure I follow why that is interesting. Have the Daleks not spoken about regenerations before? Another question; Anyone else hear Smith's voice merge with Capaldi's during the "come and get me" moment? Maybe I'm hearing things, but I think it's in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 It's interesting because traditionally, the regeneration is at the end of the episode, damage is done, the story is resolved and its denouement time. Also, the Christmas specials are generally self-contained, not cliffhangers. So, if there's still Daleks trucking around while he's regenerating, it might imply that CapaldiDoc actually hits the ground running and does stuff in this episode aside from just appearing at the end of the regeneration. Or maybe the current Doc just "holds it in" like the last one did and the Daleks know it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue 3 Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 Exactly - with them being present still at this point, it does give the option of it being a regeneration earlier than we normally see in a final episode. He could be fleeing back to the safety of the Tardis maybe if his main objective is complete I guess. Also, I wonder who the person is that Clara is talking to off camera, asking for their help... Not long to go now! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transducer X Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 It's interesting because traditionally, the regeneration is at the end of the episode, damage is done, the story is resolved and its denouement time. Also, the Christmas specials are generally self-contained, not cliffhangers. I'd say The End of TIme pt 1 ended on a pretty massive cliffhanger on Christmas '09. I've always thought they missed a unique opportunity by not having the Doctor regenerate mid-story sometime. I guess the TV movie counts but that was 85% McGann. Also, as a back-door pilot, probably not the best time to have done such a thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rogue 3 Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 What a cliffhanger that was! I had to reach down to the floor to pick up my jaw! It seemed a long week of waiting to find out how they were to resolve that one! Agree that he should have changed - that would have been the best kept secret!With you there about the TV movie - nice to have the history remembered, but too confusing for new people to a show they wanted to relaunch and they wisely avoided that with the Eccleston series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 16, 2013 Share Posted December 16, 2013 I see now, that's a great point about the possibility of a regen earlier in the story. So if Smith's voice in that one line is merging with Capaldi's then that could lend credence to the idea of a cliffhanger battle or earlier regen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 17, 2013 Share Posted December 17, 2013 It's interesting because traditionally, the regeneration is at the end of the episode, damage is done, the story is resolved and its denouement time. Also, the Christmas specials are generally self-contained, not cliffhangers.I'd say The End of TIme pt 1 ended on a pretty massive cliffhanger on Christmas '09. I've always thought they missed a unique opportunity by not having the Doctor regenerate mid-story sometime. I guess the TV movie counts but that was 85% McGann. Also, as a back-door pilot, probably not the best time to have done such a thing. Good point-- but we knew we were getting new episodes before long. Capaldi's run doesn't start until March. I guess they've had cliffhangers hang on that long... it's more American to end a season on a cliffhanger, where as the British sensibility is to do it for the mid-season break. Who knows! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 So that happened. Sorta felt like Lindelof wrote it... no payoff. Also I'm growing weary of the Doctor "holding on", just die. Sounds harsh, but really the older Doctors would have moments that just happened and boom! Moved on. All this "resetting" and "holding on" to get a hullabaloo ending hurts the moment, IMO. Don't get me wrong, the episode had some wonderful monents. Loved 'Handles'. Granny was neat. Clara's resolve and "grip" was great (would have loved to see that from her POV). The Boy Who Waited was a nice touch. Everything other than that felt hamfisted and super rushed, almost like the episode was hacked to pieces in post. Afterthought: In 25 years for DW's 75th anniversary it could be neat if Matt returns in a story featuring the old 11th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Well I liked it... As usual Moffat clears up major conspiracy plot points with a single line or two. I liked the regenerations being finally canonized, especially the War Doctor and Tennant's re-up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 So, the Doctor is what? 1500+ years old now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Obviously there were plot holes galore, and inconsistencies, and unanswered questions-- mainly, if they changed the outcome of the battle of adrenal ore, how does Clara become the impossible girl? I could handle retconning Galifrey because removing it from the universe still worked with the timelock stories. But changing the whole reason he found Clara opens up some serious holes. At the end of the day though I loved some of the monologues Smith had in this episode, so I liked it. One theory floating around the innarwebs... Tasha Lem.... LEM backwards is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 ****ing time travel, that's all in Clara's personal past though, right? How does DW typically handle changing someone's past? Ok, so if Twelve (right? we're sticking with the original numbering for simplicity's sake?) doesn't remember how to fly the Tardis, are we thinking he won't remember what really happened to Gallifrey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 He could just be confused-- being crazy post regeneration has happened several times. So I'm digging the Tasha = River theory. There's a familiarity between them, he kisses her, there is an off hand remark about River to remind us about her, the Papal Mainframe sounds like a computer-based society, last we saw River (chronologically) her consciousness was uploaded into a computer, last time we saw River on the show (episode wise) she was a hologram on Trenzalore, Tasha holograms herself everywhere, Tasha knew how to fly the Tardis, River is the only person aside the Doctor we've seen fly it with any skill... So what I think happened... AFTER she was uploaded into the library computer she later was transferred to the papal mainframe and ultimately became their leader. since the Doctor knew who she was, I'm assuming he had a part in getting her a new body. The battle of Trenzalore happens, and the Papal Mainframe crashes on the planet or is blown up, but not before Tasha/River hacks herself into the Tardis and sends it to Clara so the Doctor doesn't die alone, which we saw in Name of the Doctor. Clara does her time stream trick, becomes the impossible girl, and makes the Doctor wary of Trenzalore which makes the outcome play out as it does in Time of the Doctor, where Tasha's body is being taken over by Dalek programming. Given she is a program herself, she overcomes it. Which means the splinter group she mentions are the ones that kidnap her as a baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 Makes sense. But Eleven kisses everybody, so that's not really a good argument. But the others are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Torch Posted December 26, 2013 Share Posted December 26, 2013 I pegged River as the Papal Mainframe too, but seasons ago. If you rewatch the Eye-Patch episodes when the computer talks it is totally female and it sorta sounds like Kingston. Wouldn't be surprised if that was intentional or maybe just a happy ADR accident and Kingston just read a few lines to fill in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R.CAllen Posted December 27, 2013 Share Posted December 27, 2013 I assumed that the first draft of the episode had River Song in it but the actress wasn't available so they did a quick rewrite and now Tasha Lem is the Thanos to River Song's Darkseid. I do, however, like Tank's read on it but I imagine if it's correct then Tasha Lem doesn't know she's River but, naturally, The Doctor does. - The "everyone's naked under their clothes" line is one of Gaiman's from The Sandman. - Is the truth field still working hundreds of years later when The Doctor lies to the kid about having a plan? - Not sure how I feel about using regeneration as a weapon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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