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Ethan Crumbly's parents


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Definitely in the running for WORST PARENTS EVER.  Buying a troubled 15 year old a Sig Saur for Christmas, and when he draws dead people, they don't even bother to take the kid out of school to get him help, but argue to keep him there without checking to see if he has his gun.  Indeed, they didn't even keep the kid's gun locked up.  Of course we all know how that ended: 4 teens dead, others wounded.  What makes this school shooting different is law enforcement is actually going after the parents in this case.  At the time of this writing, the parents are missing and law enforcement has charged each parent with 4 counts of manslaughter.  If you ask me, that needs to happen more often.  Especially with parents like this.  What say you?

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I think it's good that Michigan has laws on the books that allow them to be charged for their part in this entire ordeal. There was obviously some neglect going on here, and I'm glad people can potentially be held accountable for their actions or lack thereof. 

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11 minutes ago, Fozzie said:

I’m just impressed that this hasn’t become a political issue.

Oh it will when the parents go to trial.  In fact I am surprised the NRA hasn't posted bail.   No one will die on the hill for the shooter, but I know there have to be gun rights activists that will oppose the prosecution of the parents, because they are the same type of people as those parents. 

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Given the huge gun culture here, I’ve been pleasantly surprised by the fact that I haven’t seen support for the parents on the posts on social media by my local stations.

It seems like a lot of them are completely pissed by the lack of responsibility and safety exhibited by the parents

Of course, now that I have said this, I imagine the crazies will come out of the woodworks, ranting about how unfair this is.

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5 minutes ago, Jacen123 said:

Given the huge gun culture here, I’ve been pleasantly surprised by the fact that I haven’t seen support for the parents on the posts on social media by my local stations.

It seems like a lot of them are completely pissed by the lack of responsibility and safety exhibited by the parents

Of course, now that I have said this, I imagine the crazies will come out of the woodworks, ranting about how unfair this is.

It's because Fox News, News Max, Breitbart, and Q haven't given them their marching orders on how upset they need to be, yet.  Trust me, as the normal news media criticize the parents, right wing media will inevitably take the opposing view.  It's just a matter of time. 

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It'll be hard for them because the irresponsibility goes beyond just providing a gun. There were clear signs of mental distress in their son that they completely ignored. To defend them, the NRA and their worshipers will have to compromise their typical tactic of blaming mental health. This case goes well beyond just gun rights. There's a lot to unpack here, and there is negligence at every turn. 

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I don't doubt that Fox, Newsmax, OAN, Breitbart, or Q can find a way to do some crazy bending and twisting to support the parents. I just think that it'll be hard. And the NRA might stay out of it. 

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6 hours ago, Cerina said:

It'll be hard for them because the irresponsibility goes beyond just providing a gun. There were clear signs of mental distress in their son that they completely ignored. To defend them, the NRA and their worshipers will have to compromise their typical tactic of blaming mental health. This case goes well beyond just gun rights. There's a lot to unpack here, and there is negligence at every turn. 

 

6 hours ago, Fozzie said:

I’m torn between Zathras and Cerina in my thoughts.

Overall, I won’t be surprised either way but I’m going to celebrate that it isn’t happening now.

 

5 hours ago, Cerina said:

I don't doubt that Fox, Newsmax, OAN, Breitbart, or Q can find a way to do some crazy bending and twisting to support the parents. I just think that it'll be hard. And the NRA might stay out of it. 

We ARE talking about the same people who think there was nothing wrong with Jan 6th and that Trump was completely innocent.  

These guys never let the truth get in the way of their narrative.   I don't think anyone will support Ethan Crumbly, but you have to understand that there are a lot of asshole parents that think and act the same way as the Crumblys, and will end up sympathizing with the parents.  If for no other reason than they deep down know they too could be held accountable for their own kids' actions some day.   

 

4 hours ago, Destiny Skywalker said:

The NRA would be smart to lay low for awhile, not just on this one.

Agreed, but I would not be surprised if they won't.  There are already people coming out and being critical of the charges against the parents, saying that there is no law against NOT securing a gun in a home in Michigan.

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These are also the same people who have convinced at least one parent of a Marjory Stoneman Douglas survivor that the shooting never happened. I’m sure this shooting also didn’t happen and they’re just going after these parents because they’re patriots.

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13 hours ago, Zathras said:

......and the crazies are starting to come out.  Sooner than I thought. 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/12/05/us/thomas-massie-kentucky-representative-guns-family-photo/index.html

Good grief, the gall of posting something like that shortly after a shooting! I mean, it's tasteless anyway but even worse after a tragedy. The nuts in this country make me want to immigrate to somewhere else.

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3 hours ago, Hobbes said:

I have to disagree a bit.  While I think the most responsible person is the shooter, and the parents also deserve prosecution.  However, I think the school should not have allowed the kid back into school.  Furthermore, they should have called the police and had him searched right there on the spot.  That said, I don't think criminal charges should be brought against the school or administrators, but I think civilly speaking, if I had a kid that was killed because they didn't search this shooter, I would definitely sue the school district.  

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Working in a school is an entirely thankless, difficult job. But whether there’s legal culpability or not, it seems that the administration allowed themselves to be bullied into allowing four children to be murdered because the parents wouldn’t willingly take the murderer home before he killed.

Whether there’s criminal or civil penalties is beyond my scope, but there’s definitely room for outrage and anger to be pointed in their direction as well. A lot of people made really bad calls that allowed this tragedy to occur. 

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Sigh, and this is going to set a precedent for sending home students with behavior problems and special services. I've seen so many of my friends tell me that their kids with ASD and other neurological differences get sent home when they get to be "too much", but that is largely based on teacher discretion. They tried to do that with my son the first week of school and I pushed back because it is his legal right to be in school if he is not causing physical harm to himself or others. To me there is a clear difference between a Kindergartener with ASD and a high school student drawing disturbing things. What it will probably mean is more suspensions for all kids, but students with special needs will get the short end of that stick.

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11 hours ago, Fozzie said:

Working in a school is an entirely thankless, difficult job. But whether there’s legal culpability or not, it seems that the administration allowed themselves to be bullied into allowing four children to be murdered because the parents wouldn’t willingly take the murderer home before he killed.

Whether there’s criminal or civil penalties is beyond my scope, but there’s definitely room for outrage and anger to be pointed in their direction as well. A lot of people made really bad calls that allowed this tragedy to occur. 

I agree.   The teachers did what they were supposed to, the admin did call the parents.  Where I think the admin dropped the ball was not being more assertive and demanding a search.  I concede there may very well be a law or policy that the admin followed, but I am going by news reports that the school was justified to search the shooter's locker and person.  Now that is NOT to say the school is anywhere near as culpable as the shooter or his parents, and I don't think the school is criminally responsible, but like I said before, if I had a kid that was shot in that incident, I would be suing. 

10 hours ago, Destiny Skywalker said:

Sigh, and this is going to set a precedent for sending home students with behavior problems and special services. I've seen so many of my friends tell me that their kids with ASD and other neurological differences get sent home when they get to be "too much", but that is largely based on teacher discretion. They tried to do that with my son the first week of school and I pushed back because it is his legal right to be in school if he is not causing physical harm to himself or others. To me there is a clear difference between a Kindergartener with ASD and a high school student drawing disturbing things. What it will probably mean is more suspensions for all kids, but students with special needs will get the short end of that stick.

Hopefully not, because there is a difference between special needs kids simply acting out, and death threats. However, regardless if they are special needs or not,  I think any kid who makes death or injury threats (verbal, written, picture, or online) should be expelled in this day and age.   These days, there is no way to know if there is a gun at home and if said kid who made the threat has access to that gun.   

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I preface with what I am about to say that I am a gun owner. I have a shotgun. It's all I need. All I want. And it works effectively for deterrent and possible pest control (I grew up on a ranch). And I am a teacher so I have seen many things in my years as a teacher that make me shake my head.

MY GOD WHAT KIND OF IDIOTS ... 

They bought it as a gift for their problem child. Like were they getting advice from the NRA who's job is basically to ensure that gun makers stay in business and make lots of money off these idiots? I genuinely think the brain cells of American's who crowd into these camps of people who won't wear masks or get vaccinated or believe they have a right to buy and do what they want with guns are shared like a one celled creature.

And then their kid does something unthinkable and they run away? Like let's abandon this kid. They can make more since they don't believe abortion is probably a right for women's health. What that kid needed his parents were not prepared to give or provide. What horrible human beings. The consequences of his actions includes his parents stepping up and owning their mistakes but I find that a lot of parents just don't want that. It's the schools fault. They need to control all these kids.

I work in an innercity school and there's a lot of stuff that you have to do to even get a child looked after that presents issues. Budgets are strained to not offer a ton of things that are needed if we're going to send emotionally fragile kids to school. Bullying or abnormal behaviors have to be documented and there's a process. But all the parties have to help or want to fix the issue. Which I think includes parents stepping up to commit to doing something at home. 

Cowardice and fear rule these wacko's lives. 

Every time something like this happens in America the more I think we can't take guns responsibly. We shouldn't have them. If we can't have abortion then they can't have guns. 

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