Jump to content

dumb questions


Recommended Posts

2 hours ago, Tank said:

Hahaha-- I mean, it wouldn't nightly without ruining the Star Wars we all love. But yeah, I agree with you. ROTJ is the one I recall best from childhood. I very clearly remember going to the theater to see it. My memories of the other two are just watching them on VHS over and over.

I think my first cynical SW thoughts came in the early 90s when I started to think about movie writing and structure and realized how much of a shit show ROTJ was.

 

ROTJ always bothered me. I think I was a Sophmore in high school when that movie came out and I watched it countless times on cable. Just the fact that the moon of Endor had a forest was a big question mark for me. How does a moon even have an atmosphere?

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 639
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

Well, it's only fitting that his post would be bastdoordized.

This is the dumbest and greatest question of allllllll time. 

The rightererer decision would have been to make more. 

Posted Images

All these years, I always thought that Luke entered the Palace because Leia wasn't able to get Han out.

Luke may have been a little overconfident, but I think he just thought that either he could negotiate with Jabba.  Figuring this wouldn't work, he must have thought he was good enough of a Jedi to just get his friends out by force.....with the Force.

So that's what I always thought the plan was.  Still makes no sense.

It's all a series of crazy conveniences and luck.  We should talk about what would YOU have done?!

First, I wouldn't have sent the droids at all.  Forget offering them as a gift.  Pointless.  Lando being undercover is a good idea but in the film, it served no purpose.  If the wanted a layout of the place and knowledge of entrances and exits, where everything is, fine.  They could also have found someone on Tatoooine who has knowledge of the Palace and could have given them intel as well.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Jedigoat said:

.

It's all a series of crazy conveniences and luck.  We should talk about what would YOU have done?!

 

As a screenwriter, To fix what’s currently there, you’d need a couple spots of them saying what the plan was supposed to be — maybe when Chewie briefs Han, and have them acknowledge they are improvising.

Or maybe a shot of Luke waiting and realizing they aren’t showing up.

If I were writing it from scratch, the Leia gambit worked. I’d have them come in as a crew, Luke, Leia, and Lando, as bounty hunters, Chewie as prisoner. Establish the door guards TAKE WEAPONS like a gun check in a western, and keep the bit with the droids to get the lightsaber in. Instead of Han being frozen, he’s in a cell. So Chewie gets to him, briefs him, the three Ls break them out, they get caught, that sends them to the Sarlacc., proceed as is.

Alternate for something completely different, write it like a heist scene with twists and turns, where the loot is Han in carbonate. There were lots of sequences in Mando and Solo that have the right vibe.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The need is for them to tell us the plan so that when something goes wrong we know it went wrong. 

How about this: 

After the Death Star open we go to Tatooine, Mos Eisley Cantina specifically. Chewie is at a table in a far corner alone. Two figures cloaked in hoods enter and head for Chewie, its Luke and Leia. Leia comments that she doesn't see why they had to leave the droids outside, Luke responds "first time here, huh?". Chewie has been on Tatooine with Lando for a while setting the stage for the rescue. Chewie gets them up to date, Lando is in position undercover as a guard in Jabbas Palace. He has inside info that Jabba is going out on his sail barge late morning. This means most of his guards go with him, leaving the Palace fairly unguarded. Lando will be one of the guards back at the palace, he will make sure the Palace Gate is open at midday. Luke, Leia, Chewie and the droids show up to open doors and fewer guards. They get in and out before Jabba even knows they are there.

Cut to Lando anxiously waiting for Jabba to leave on the barge. The captain of the guards though approaches Lando and informs him he is now needed on the barge. Lando protests but if he does too much it could blow his cover so he agrees to go. He mutters under his breath "I guess we will have to do this some other day."

Luke, Leia etc. show up the gates closed. The plan is already askwe. They wonder if Lando has again betrayed them. They decided to go through with the rescue though. They get into the Palace somehow, either tricking their way in, Artoo doing it, Luke using a mind trick, whatever. Once inside they don't know where Han is though inside the Palace. Plus the small number of guards on duty realize something is wrong. One runs for a comm unit to alert the barge. Leia shoots him just as he begins to send a message. Did the message get through? We don't know.

Our heroes simply don;t know where Han is though and this is taking too long. The message evidently did go through though as Jabba returns with his full compliments of guards and mercenaries. All hell breaks loose. Lando says to himself "those crazy bastards went through with it anyway." He sets off to get Han, as he knows where he is. He finds him and unfreezes him. Han is understandably hesitant to trust Lando but he has little choice so the 2 run off together.

The rest of our heroes are more or less just fighting for their lives as more of Jabbas men pour into the palace. Eventually Han and Lando run into them. Luke and Leia are none too happy with Lando for his failure to have the gate open as promised. Lando barks back "this is not my fault, this is not my fault."

Once again united our heroes fight their way through the palace back outside to their speeder and they all pile in and jet off across the desert. Han comments that Jabba won't let them get away this easy and expect to have some company pretty quickly. We hear Artoo make some beeps. Threepio translates "oh it seems Artoo has gone ahead and took it upon himself..." Luke asks "take it upon himself to what?". Just as he finishes the entire palace goes up in a huge explosion. Threepio finishes his thought "to program the gas tanks to explode". Lando, not knowing Artoo like the others, increduously asks "The droid did that?"

Link to post
Share on other sites

Killing Jabba offscreen is a bad idea, IMO. I’ve always liked that it was Leia who takes Jabba out. It wasn’t just poetic justice for him enslaving her in the bikini outfit. It was also her asserting herself by taking out the slug who imprisoned the guy she loved and tried to kill her friends. Plus what she has stood for all her life is the complete opposite of how Jabba operates. She unknowingly killed part of the clan who had enslaved her grandmother and father.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/11/2021 at 12:05 AM, Dark Wader said:

Titan has an atmosphere. . . 

It's mostly Nitrogen. And below is mostly rivers of methane and Ethan released into the atmosphere from under the surface volcanic activity. It's one big Yellowstone park, minus the surrounding forest and life.

I'd imagine that the one side that constantly faces the planet would have a very violent existence.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah but it’s a moon with an atmosphere that orbits a gas giant.

But not to sound as if I’m defending the science of Star Wars here. I actually like it completely ignores science, something I don’t need to think about. Otherwise the whole series would just fall apart

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/10/2021 at 7:33 PM, Tank said:

That's what I have always assumed, but it doesn't quite hold up. Let's look at the for sure parameters:

1. Lando goes in undercover.

2. The droids are sent in undercover. 3P0 is not in on the plan, R2 is. R2 smuggles in a lightsaber.

3. Leia goes in undercover, and offers Chewie up as a prisoner.

So with Lando going in-- this makes sense. He's scouting things out, being a man on the inside. This checks out fine. Next, the droids. 3p0 is an idiot, so it makes sense not to clue him in. R2, as we see, is there to get Luke a weapon if he needs it... but here's the first little problem.

Why does Luke need to smuggle in the lightsaber? Everybody is armed at Jabba's. Leia comes in with a blaster and a thermal detonator. Fett is walking around fully armored, ready to fight. Luke is never searched going in, in fact, he rolls in and starts force choking out guards and mind tricking fools. He comes in so aggro, it turns into a fight really quick. 

It seems like at this stage the plan is, Luke is going to show up and ask nicely for Han back because that's the Jedi way... but he's pretty sure Jabba is going to tell him to suck it, so he wants to be ready for a fight with everyone in place.

This alone, which I think is the intended implication, makes sense. But it veers off fast from here.

The problems are-- one, he didn't need to smuggle the lightsaber in. Two, if he wanted to negotiate, why come in fucking up Jabba's staff and forcing a fight? And three, rewinding a bit, here's the things that make NO sense as part of the plan, but seemed inevitable.

4. Chewie is thrown into a cell.

5. R2 is specifically assigned drinks duty on the sail barge.

6. Leia frees Han and gets them both captured.

So if Chewie is incarcerated, how can he help if things turn into a fight? How do they know Jabba won't execute him on the spot? 

The R2 situation is a can of worms. Did they know ahead of time Jabba needed a waiter for the Sail Barge? Cause it sure was handy he was there to deliver a lightsaber.

Leia freeing Han is the biggest confusion of all. When she unthaws him, she says "let's get the eff out of here" (paraphrasing). So if THIS was part of the plan, and they are ready to escape now in the middle of the night-- what about Chewie in his cell? Where's Lando? For that matter, this is BEFORE Luke shows up, so what's his role at this moment?

The way Luke so confidently says "I'm taking care of everything" to Han on the way to the desert carnivore butthole implies everything is going according to plan.

That is insane. That means Luke's plan was this--

Get Lando in place. Get Chewie captured, not killed, and thrown into a cell specifically so he can fill Han in on the plan after Leia frees him and they intentionally get caught-- again, knowing Jabba won't kill them on the spot. Get R2 a job on the Sail Barge to get Luke his lightsaber at the exact moment he needs it, which, will happen after Luke is already fed to one pet monster and kills it, ensuring Jabba will be so mad he'll THEN decide they all have to die via desert carnivore butthole. He even knows that the skiffs have magnet cranes to rescue the droids after they jump overboard.

If Luke was so strong in the force he could see into a future THAT detailed, he'd have never gone to Endor in the first place.

  Then...he didn't set any of that up! Lando went out and was casing the place out to try and free Han on his own. Then Leia, getting impatient, went ahead and tried it her own way. Luke, figuring their dumb asses would all get captured, hung back  and built a new saber during all this, sending the droids ahead just in case afterwards. The only part he wasn't counting on was the trapdoor and the Rancor. Or maybe he was! Since he didn't have R2 bust out the saber right away.

Link to post
Share on other sites

That makes sense to me. Everyone went off and did their own thing when none of them felt the other was getting things done. And then Luke fails to pick up on Threepio’s warning? He clearly says, “Master Luke, you’re standing on…” Luke should’ve at least done a double take to see what exactly he was standing on considering where he is and who he’s dealing with. He thought just by grabbing the gun through the Force he’d be able to force Jabba to do what he says at gunpoint? 

Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know if it implies that. If I come up from working in the basement and the three year old has had an accident and pooped in the kitchen, the 8 year old is hanging from the ceiling and the 6 year old is crying for no reason, and I tell my wife "Go away, I'm taking care of everything" that doesn't mean I planned any of it. I mean, I absolutely did because I want to ruin her life, but that statement doesn't imply it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Lord Darth Hunter said:

That makes sense to me. Everyone went off and did their own thing when none of them felt the other was getting things done. And then Luke fails to pick up on Threepio’s warning? He clearly says, “Master Luke, you’re standing on…” Luke should’ve at least done a double take to see what exactly he was standing on considering where he is and who he’s dealing with. He thought just by grabbing the gun through the Force he’d be able to force Jabba to do what he says at gunpoint? 

For real, him grabbing the gun was a bluff! He's a Jedi and all but he's in a room full of armed goons, they would take him out in seconds. He needed some open area for that lightsaber action! He probably knew about Jabba feeding people to the Sarlacc, so figured pissing him off by killing the Rancor would force him to do so. He did used to live on Tatooine after all, he must have heard about Jabba before.

Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Fozzie said:

I don't know if it implies that. If I come up from working in the basement and the three year old has had an accident and pooped in the kitchen, the 8 year old is hanging from the ceiling and the 6 year old is crying for no reason, and I tell my wife "Go away, I'm taking care of everything" that doesn't mean I planned any of it. I mean, I absolutely did because I want to ruin her life, but that statement doesn't imply it.

Iffy.

But I'll allow it.

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Tank said:

Iffy.

But I'll allow it.

 

3 hours ago, Fozzie said:

I don't know if it implies that. If I come up from working in the basement and the three year old has had an accident and pooped in the kitchen, the 8 year old is hanging from the ceiling and the 6 year old is crying for no reason, and I tell my wife "Go away, I'm taking care of everything" that doesn't mean I planned any of it. I mean, I absolutely did because I want to ruin her life, but that statement doesn't imply it.

True that. Luke saying this confidently to Han feels more like, well, it didn’t go the way I had planned, but I still know how I’m going to salvage this. Everybody just step back and watch me go to work. It was Luke’s version of Anakin in TCW series getting out of messes he helped create. 

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 12/12/2021 at 9:54 PM, Dark Wader said:

Yeah but it’s a moon with an atmosphere that orbits a gas giant.

But not to sound as if I’m defending the science of Star Wars here. I actually like it completely ignores science, something I don’t need to think about. Otherwise the whole series would just fall apart

I hear ya!

 

Space battles would be pretty boring, if Hollywood followed the rules of science.

Link to post
Share on other sites

I know that this has been brought up before, but wasn't the whole "chosen one" theme Lucas created for the prequels kind of redundant because Palp would have died on the Death Star anyway when it blew?  Even if Vader hadn't turned back to the light side and killed Palp, he would have been just as dead a few minutes later anyway.  So why the chosen one?  I've heard it argued that Palp would have had plenty of time to get off the DS before it blew, but I'm not sure I buy that.  Palp never took the rebel attack seriously to begin with.  He was way too overconfident I can't see him just abandoning the DS after all the trash-talk he gave Luke about how everything goes according to his designs, etc.

I think Lucas should have had Anakin build the Millenium Falcon in the prequels.  That way, he's also indirectly responsible for the destruction of the DS.  

Link to post
Share on other sites

The deleted scenes of the Death Star planning to blow Endor would've been a good inclusion as a backup plan. But I think the idea, is if Vader hadn't turned and killed Palpatine, the Dark Side would've still been powerful enough to overcome the Rebels. At least that's the explanation I accept.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, but what if the Emperor really didn't die, and came back to threaten the galaxy once again, 30 years later. Wouldn't that be boss? Someone should make a movie about that.  They wouldn't even need to explain how he survived.

Oh, wait...

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Quetzalcoatl said:

I know that this has been brought up before, but wasn't the whole "chosen one" theme Lucas created for the prequels kind of redundant because Palp would have died on the Death Star anyway when it blew?  Even if Vader hadn't turned back to the light side and killed Palp, he would have been just as dead a few minutes later anyway.  So why the chosen one?  I've heard it argued that Palp would have had plenty of time to get off the DS before it blew, but I'm not sure I buy that.  Palp never took the rebel attack seriously to begin with.  He was way too overconfident I can't see him just abandoning the DS after all the trash-talk he gave Luke about how everything goes according to his designs, etc.

I think Lucas should have had Anakin build the Millenium Falcon in the prequels.  That way, he's also indirectly responsible for the destruction of the DS.  

 Well, if we are to believe that Palp was using battle meditation to keep the Imperial fleet in cohesion. The moment he was thrown down the Death Star's Core, was when the Imperial Fleet started getting its arse handed to it.

 

 I find it funny that blowing up the Disney Orlando ball on top of the Executor, would take out the shields of the command center for the ship. How did that monster crashing into the Death Star not destroy it?

Link to post
Share on other sites

×
×
  • Create New...