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Notre Dame Cathedral


33 replies to this topic

#1
Ms. Spam

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Gone. Or at least the best parts. :(



#2
Ms. Spam

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https://www.npr.org/...edral-in-flames



#3
Metropolis

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Thankfully no one was hurt.

#4
Ms. Spam

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Right!? I read that there were 2000 people inside when it caught fire. It's amazing only one firefighter was hurt.



#5
Odine

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Oh well, its just a building. Buildings can be re built. Like Met said, nobody was hurt so that's the main thing.

Everyone on social media crying at the tragedy need to put it into perspective. Its just a building. And nobody cried when the ancient city of Petra was pillaged by ISIS. Or the countless historical treasures lost in The Cradle of Civilisation (Iraq, Syria, Egypt et al). But I suppose antiquities of ancient Babylon, Assyria and Egypt aren't as important as a flagship of the Holy Christian empire.

One cathedral catches fire in France and people lose their ****.

Edited by Odine, 16 April 2019 - 01:00 AM.

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#6
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I am sad to see something literal generations worked to build be destroyed. I would probably feel worse about it if I were French or Catholic. But Im just glad no one died, and there was only one injury. Everything on this earth is temporary, this is a good reminder of that.

#7
El Chalupacabra

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#8
Ms. Spam

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I was upset by the loss of ancient places especially in Asia as well as Syria, Iran and Iraq. But if we don't respect things - even a cathedral more than 800 years old that withstood the worst parts of the 1900s - how can be mourn the loss of ancient Buddist temples in Asia, Mayan and Incan artifacts lost to jungle burns to build more farms? I totally get the loss to the Parisian people. This is something that drew tourists the world over and also reminded us of the cruelty of the Catholic Empire and was still functioning and being used daily. It was an identifier of the city. Like the Big Chicken in Marietta where I used to live as I would say "go to the Big Chicken and turn left" to get my apartment. The video of Parisians singing was amazing. 


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#9
Tank

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Oh well, its just a building. Buildings can be re built. Like Met said, nobody was hurt so that's the main thing.

Everyone on social media crying at the tragedy need to put it into perspective. Its just a building. And nobody cried when the ancient city of Petra was pillaged by ISIS. Or the countless historical treasures lost in The Cradle of Civilisation (Iraq, Syria, Egypt et al). But I suppose antiquities of ancient Babylon, Assyria and Egypt aren't as important as a flagship of the Holy Christian empire.

One cathedral catches fire in France and people lose their ****.

Gotta call BS on that.  It is a tragedy that the 900 year old landmark was gutted by fire.  It isn't just a building, but a part of history, not to mention the priceless artifacts inside.
 
Also, there WERE people upset about Petra, and the antiques that have been lost due to war in Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, etc.  Primarily, it was limited to those countries and the middle east, sure, and maybe they didn't get as much media coverage, but they did get coverage.  However, most people in the west that were upset, were people in academia (historians, archaeologists, anthropologists, etc).  True story, back when I was pursuing my history BA in 2003 (just shortly before the Iraq invasion) , I wrote a a paper and gave a class presentation about the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddha statues, as well as warning about the danger of losing the Summerian and Babylonian artifacts.  Sadly exactly that happened.   Also, I had a friend serving in the US Army in  Samarra  when the Al-Askari mosque was bombed, which people world wide considered a tragedy and received considerable media attention at the time (social media wasn't as big as now). I think that structure's loss can be directly compared to Notre Dame (terrorist angle aside...I am talking about the loss of the building and artifacts itself).


Yeah, I agree-- I'm not religious at all, but that joint is a place of power. It's a nexus of art, history, culture, architecture, and religion. I was there in December and was moved, despite not being remotely Christian.

#10
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Also-- latest updates-- towers are fine, 3 of the 4 primary stained glass rose windows are secure, the roof which was replaced in the 19 century is gone, but the stone vaults under it are secure save for one section. The organ is water damaged, but intact, all the historical artifacts are safe, and despite losing the spire, all of the statues that lived on were removed a few weeks ago as the spire was about to be refurbished.
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#11
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#12
Brando

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It's amazing how many people think it's just a museum or tourist destination. It has those aspects, but primarily acts as a place of worship.

#13
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#14
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I’m talking about the people who say it’s just a museum. That’s a hugely popular thing to say right now. And it’s a silly thing that shows the ignorance of Americans.

#15
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#16
Jacen123

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I've never been to Notre Dame, but I've visited a number of historical churches in Europe, including the Vatican.  Many of them are just powerful sites.  I'm not really religious at all now, but I was raised Catholic, and St. Peter's Basilica and St. Peter's Square were both overwhelming and peaceful to me at the same time.  No other place I have been has had that type of effect on me.  I can only imagine that Notre Dame is similar.  I am so glad that the damage to it wasn't even worse.


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#17
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I would use ignorant by it's definition of people just don't know about it. Unless you're Roman Catholic you've probably only heard of the church or seen it animated in a Disney movie. The only reason I one more than others is because it was part of my architectural history class my freshman year of college. The Taj Mahal is a know building, bit most people don't know the history of it.

#18
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Not knowing is ignorance. Making up facts because you don't know the truth goes beyond that.

#19
Odine

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Who is making up facts?

Its an iconic building and sure that's sad it got burned. But it can be repaired. And it will. But the hysteria I saw on social media (largely American) is disproportionate to the actual event. People saying things like "im physically in pain seeing this". No you're not. You're upset but you are not physically hurting because a building five thousand miles away is on fire.

I've been to Notre Dame. And yeah its a very impressive Cathedral. But there are literally THOUSANDS of cathedrals throughout the UK and Europe that, while not as famous, are equally beautiful, contain the the same amount of history, are still active places of worship (if that's your thing). People are upset because its scary. And it is a famous landmark. Seeing a big ass fire in a dense city is scary, and when it is a landmark people get emotional because they tie their identity and memories to it. Yeah its upsetting to see a place where memories and experience are going up in smoke but the tragedy is not in the loss of timber, bricks and mortar. (the last part wont be lost in fact).

Notre Dame still stands, it will still remain in the heart of Paris and will still be a place of worship for generations to come. The interior will be restored to its former glory. It will take a long time sure, but it will be repaired. And remember no one died.

Edited by Odine, 18 April 2019 - 01:05 AM.

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#20
Odine

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Oh well, its just a building. Buildings can be re built. Like Met said, nobody was hurt so that's the main thing.

Everyone on social media crying at the tragedy need to put it into perspective. Its just a building. And nobody cried when the ancient city of Petra was pillaged by ISIS. Or the countless historical treasures lost in The Cradle of Civilisation (Iraq, Syria, Egypt et al). But I suppose antiquities of ancient Babylon, Assyria and Egypt aren't as important as a flagship of the Holy Christian empire.

One cathedral catches fire in France and people lose their ****.

Gotta call BS on that.  It is a tragedy that the 900 year old landmark was gutted by fire.  It isn't just a building, but a part of history, not to mention the priceless artifacts inside.
 
Also, there WERE people upset about Petra, and the antiques that have been lost due to war in Iraq, Syria, Afghanistan, etc.  Primarily, it was limited to those countries and the middle east, sure, and maybe they didn't get as much media coverage, but they did get coverage.  However, most people in the west that were upset, were people in academia (historians, archaeologists, anthropologists, etc).  True story, back when I was pursuing my history BA in 2003 (just shortly before the Iraq invasion) , I wrote a a paper and gave a class presentation about the destruction of the Bamiyan Buddha statues, as well as warning about the danger of losing the Summerian and Babylonian artifacts.  Sadly exactly that happened.   Also, I had a friend serving in the US Army in  Samarra  when the Al-Askari mosque was bombed, which people world wide considered a tragedy and received considerable media attention at the time (social media wasn't as big as now). I think that structure's loss can be directly compared to Notre Dame (terrorist angle aside...I am talking about the loss of the building and artifacts itself).  
All I'm saying is the loss isn't really comparable. There are very few (I'm assuming) sources of ancient historical artifacts of the Sumerian, Babylonian and Assyrian empires. So when these places get destroyed the loss is much greater because we have scarce to go on in the first place. And while there may have been upset at the loss of Petra and the like it certainly wasn't part of the public consciousness like Notre Dame is. Which is sad.

The loss of European Christian medieval history at Notre Dame is ALMOST trivial by comparison, being that ALL of Europe contains thousand years old history and historical sites. The loss of wealth, and artifacts in Notre Dame is a blip when compared to the sum of all the wealth and artifacts still available throughout the churches and cathedrals of the UK and Europe. Hell, the church down the road in my town is on a site of worship that has existed since the 7th century. It was built on again in the 12th, 13th and 14th centuries and has remained a site of worship since. It has been repaired along the way. This is an incredible historical site. And this is BUT ONE church, in a town of 27,000 people. There are actually about 5 more churches in my town. Every single town in the UK has a church or a few. And every city in the UK and Europe has at least one cathedral. Hell, you can't drive a country road in the UK for 20 minutes without seeing a pretty, centuries old church with beautiful stone masonry. And all of these have comparable historical significance (just not perhaps in the public awareness) as literally EVERYWHERE in Europe is thousands and thousands and thousands of years old.

When seen in perspective the loss at Notre Dame starts to seem not so severe. It's loss, is largely symbolic or is in the psyche of the people.. Not in the physical things that were destroyed.

Edited by Odine, 18 April 2019 - 01:52 AM.


#21
Brando

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Who is making up facts?


People elsewhere on the internet who boldly proclaim that it is solely a museum, and then double down when told it's an active church.

#22
Odine

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Who is making up facts?

People elsewhere on the internet who boldly proclaim that it is solely a museum, and then double down when told it's an active church.

Ah ok

#23
monkeygirl

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Oh well, its just a building. Buildings can be re built. Like Met said, nobody was hurt so that's the main thing.

Everyone on social media crying at the tragedy need to put it into perspective. Its just a building. And nobody cried when the ancient city of Petra was pillaged by ISIS. Or the countless historical treasures lost in The Cradle of Civilisation (Iraq, Syria, Egypt et al). But I suppose antiquities of ancient Babylon, Assyria and Egypt aren't as important as a flagship of the Holy Christian empire.

One cathedral catches fire in France and people lose their ****.

I 'cried' when Petra was damaged-a LOT. Did you check the reactions of each person that's sad about this from 2015 to be sure their reactions were lacking in Petra's destruction? I do not understand this sentiment and saw it on Facebook from many. I was called "eurocentric" for being sad about a gorgeous piece of architecture over 1000 years old being damaged. I see this as MUCH more than 'one cathedral in France'. It's arguably the most well-known cathedral in the world. How are people supposed to react to this?



#24
Odine

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I don't feel like I need to explain my view any more on this subject when my last two longer posts explain my point of view pretty thoroughly.

#25
monkeygirl

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I don't feel like I need to answer this because it's dumb





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