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Avengers: Endgame SPOILER THREAD


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I just got out of it a little while ago and had a post movie beer (or 3) so a bit over the place... Overall I enjoyed it - honestly did think it was a little long, I don't think superheroes benefit from this kind of run time. But the second half was exceptional. Or at least the last hour. That was the culmination of all of the MCU - I don't really see how they'll be able to build up future phases to be better than that, unless they stay more individual focused from here on.

 

But I need to see it again to really digest it. They did a lot of things in the film I wasn't expecting and some of those elements I'm still not sure how I feel about. But the cameos were all fantastic.

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Theory I had earlier after my second viewing: the use of the stones twice on earth triggers a latent recessive gene carried by some people, causing them to develop certain mutations. Then, you can slo

The more this film gets explained by fans (me included) and the creatives behind it the less I like the movie.

I would pay dearly for a movie that's just Thanos being brought to his knees by Hawkguy, Kate Bishop, and Pizza Dog, but that's just me.

A few items here with big spoilers, so please don't go looking until you have seen the film!

 

 

This link gives some thought as to the plot holes I was thinking about when I left the cinema:
https://www.news.com.au/entertainment/movies/new-movies/avengers-endgame-time-travelling-explained/news-story/949981fddf5d209ec0d6952956c8a156

Also, I hadn't realised who the random kid was at the end, but he was the actor who played the young lad in Iron Man 3. Nice touch.

 

Pleased that Captain Marvel was used sparingly - it was good to see our originals gang having fun. Peter was still searching for Gamora at the end there, so that will be interesting to see what happens next.

 

 

Have to say that it was really great fun to watch - think they did a great job wrapping it all up and I'm looking forward to seeing it again soon.

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SPOILERS BELOW
I absolutely loved this movie, for the most part. It was full of fanservice and callbacks without being hokey, it was hilarious without shifting the tone too much, it gave closure to so many almost decade-long story arcs, and it delivered a lot of the epic splash page goods that I've wanted to see ever since an Avengers movie was announced.
It's insane that this movie can even exist. Some of the characters and scenarios on screen would have been laughable even as recently as five years ago. But with all the MCU setup we've been given, it all feels believable, organic, and damned awesome.
Things I loved:
  • Visiting all the past MCU movies. It was just like the fun parts of the last act of Back to the Future II where you get to see a past movie from a different perspective. Seeing the Avengers and SHIELD take Loki away after Avengers 1 ended was hilarious, especially when everyone freaked out when Hulk tried to get on the elevator with them.
  • Cap's story seeing an awesome ending. Not just in terms of finally getting that dance with Peggy, but seeing him and Tony make nice, seeing him come to terms with how hokey he used to be, and also that huge metaphorical shot of him being ready to take on all of the Thanos army himself.
  • I also loved the purposefully slow and intimate pace of the second act. Getting to see how all of the team reacted to years of accepted defeat felt like a MCU version of The Leftovers. All of those close character moments really set up amazing payoffs for the epic scenes in the last acts. A lot of it was also hilarious and over the top, and yet still felt right.
  • THAT scene towards the end. It's like ten years and twenty something movies led to it. Right when Cap is about to basically commit suicide by standing up to the Thanos army, all of the characters we've met and grown to love warp in and have his back. And then on top of that, you finally get the climatic "Assemble" callout. I have NEVER heard shouting in a theater like that, it was like I was at a college football game instead of a theater. I will remember that amazing moment in the theater the rest of my life.
Things I didn't care for:
  • The rules of time travel here are a little wonky and seemed to be shaped just so they can serve the plot. Just because the characters make fun of Back to the Future doesn't mean that they can believably handle time travel in a way that the audience has learned over decades to not handle as believable. Messing with the past to create limitless alternate timelines seems like a cheat as opposed to changing the future.
  • Captain Marvel saying she has to keep an eye on the rest of the universe is a really lame excuse for making her an Ex Machina whenever the plot requires her.
  • The five year gap is going to be a big problem for future MCU movies to deal with. Like, how does Peter Parker even go back to school? All of his surviving classmates would be far along in college by now, while he's still a Sophomore or Junior in high school. Isn't Aunt May going to be an emotional wreck if she was unsnapped and still around? Also, Scott's daughter Cassie has aged five years, do all of her friends come back undusted as the same age when they left? It just feels messy and doesn't make a lot of sense.
Overall I do think I liked this a good bit more than Infinity War. It was a little too balls to the wall in terms of pace and action, even though that was fun. Endgame has a lot of problems with the SciFi mechanics of how it moves its own plot and the MCU as a whole forward, but it still unapologetically takes its time and takes a closer look at the characters and what's happened to really make the last giant epic scene and all of those little moments in it pay off big time.
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Ah mate - sorry to have left temptation out there!

 

What do we think about Cap returning the Soul stone? Firstly how that happens (!), but mainly if that is a trade back for one of the 2 souls that were lost?

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ALSO

 

Giant-Man punching down a Leviathian

 

A-Force

 

Hail Hydra!

 

Valkyrie and Korg

 

Hawkeye kicking ass

 

Cap, can you hear me? Its Sam ...on your left.

 

CAP FINALLY GIVING ME MY ASSEMBLE LINE. Not at all ashamed to admit I teared up for it. I wanted that line so bad.

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So...

 

I'll be a little bummed if everyone snapped out in IW doesn't come back to the very and and we really only get everyone at once for a couple minutes.

I knew it was inevitable, as was Carol's usage... and I'm far too jaded and know how the cookies are made to get choked up by the emotional beats I saw coming.... BUT, yeah, like DRay said...

 

The comic reading kid in me never expected to see that battle at the end, with literally everyone getting a moment... I got a little misty.

 

Second act drug a bit, and I too am confused as to how 5 years later worked for Peter going back to his friends. I guess we'll have to see in the next Spider-Man movie if maybe all of them got snapped, and they're all going back to school? Those were my only real complaints.

 

So officiallly....

 

Tony- dead.

Cap- aged out.

Natasha- dead.

Vision- dead.

 

And Gamorra and Loki are alive, but from alternate timelines. Her from before joing the Guardians, and him from post Avengers 1.

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The bit about Loki I feel makes the whole time travelling thing in this movie really messy. Sure, Cap went back in time and returned the stones to their original point but that bit makes no sense to me. Doesnt that mean there is always a splintered reality? Which is what they were trying to avoid? (I get that this will obviously be the point of his solo movie)

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I think there is a lot to like and a lot to dislike about this film, which isnt surprising to me as they had to conclude a massive arc and, I guess, stretch it to three hours for some reason.

 

I have three issues, really:

 

 

1. Danvers. I didnt like how she was essentially just a proton torpedo. I imagine the writers had some heated debates over how she should be used, I dont know what would have been better, but what we got seemed like the worst option.

 

2. Thor. The character of Thor has always teeter tottered between too serious and too comedic, this film was no different in that respect. What was different was abandoning six appearances worth of Thor learning who he actually is to turn him back into who he was when Odin banished him in his first appearance. Essentially, the writers broke his arc in the most complete way they could. It is as if Simba told everyone to go fork themselves at the end of Lion King because he likes grubs and the jungle life instead.

 

3. Their solution to time travel was that any rules you think you know arent rules in our story, so we can do whatever we want. Thats fine. What isnt fine is then detailing how time is going to work in your story and then disregarding that. Which is what they do with the Sorcerer Supremes scene and the actions that then follow. That being that their time is a single stream and branches are very bad so dont make branches, then they just go ahead and plant an entire new forest, but then insist everything is fine, all fine here.

 

3a. Billions are brought back into a world where billions had not been, for five years. The logistical nightmare of that I cannot even imagine, but it might sound a lot like Thanoss wet dream scenario. Farmland reclamation by nature, infrastructure decay and reclamation, skilled labor, white collars, needy, wealthy, you name it, indiscriminately plucked out of existence for five years and then poof billions back on a planet that just sat, rotted and attempted to rebuild. Yeah. Thats going to work out just peachy. This is an issue that I think has occurred because the writers wrote a time travel reset button but refused to just commit to a time travel reset button plot. The logic of this is even more broken than Thors arc.

 

 

I hid what I wrote, I really dont want to in any small way spoil someone.

 

Afterthought: retooled what I wrote a bit. Also, non-spoilery addition right here...

 

This film and the world they presented was far more interesting a place to tell new stories before time travel was brought into it, at least their version of time travel.

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The movie was a lot of fun, impressive in that basically everyone got a moment I think, and I found it to be an extremely satisfying wrap-up.

 

I also think the OMG best movie ever takers need to settle down a little.

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For the tech, they got Pyn, Shuri, and Peter to an extent. Wakanda can pay for it.

 

I kinda wish the Defenders and Coulsen's AOS team were in the final battle too-- just a couple shots would have been fun.

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Theory I had earlier after my second viewing: the use of the stones twice on earth triggers a latent recessive gene carried by some people, causing them to develop certain mutations. Then, you can slowly roll out mutants. Storm in black panther 2, for example.

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For the tech, they got Pyn, Shuri, and Peter to an extent. Wakanda can pay for it.

 

I kinda wish the Defenders and Coulsen's AOS team were in the final battle too-- just a couple shots would have been fun.

Wouldve been perfect after Strange asked if that was everyone.
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Theory I had earlier after my second viewing: the use of the stones twice on earth triggers a latent recessive gene carried by some people, causing them to develop certain mutations. Then, you can slowly roll out mutants. Storm in black panther 2, for example.

Love this idea!

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