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So....The Mandalorian


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Calm down Karen.

JFC you babies, it's nightly. We fight about star wars.

wtf I hate this thread now

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11 hours ago, Spider-Man said:

I would very much like Disney to stop being awkward and to work out a deal with Stan.

I honestly thought that’s what had happened when I saw the episode. Then I learned here it was just an imperfect cg model. 
I’m fine with Luke being played by someone else, but it’s also fitting for Lucasfilm to be pushing innovation in special effects so I’m sure they’re going to continue down this road. 
This amount of Luke feels about right for a season. Better to leave more to the imagination about him  

If the main theme of the series is Mando protecting and delivering Grogu to his destiny, the little one won’t be with Luke for good. Star Wars has historically been about Fathers and Sons (should be updated to Parents and Children - and sort of was with the ST, but we all know how that fell apart), I do wonder if it all ends with him sacrificing himself to save his child Grogu in the end. After all, Mando’s story starts with his parents sacrificing themselves to save him.

 

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You can't recast Luke. He isn't Batman or James Bond. He's Mark Hamil, who has now played Luke at different ages. To have somebody else play him in some inserted time period is something that would not work in the long run.

Everybody stans Stan for it-- but it's a fantasy idea. Sure, they could get him to do it, but would people REALLY accept that? Or would you just be dangerously dividing the fanbase again?

Sure, they could deep fake young Mark's face on there, and do an entire series-- and it wouldn't work. It wouldn't feel right. This is a fan dream that sounds great, but I think any more Luke than what we just got would just kill the magic. It's kind of the same thing as aging Grogu up, or taking him away from the show. You're breaking the DNA of things. And if the reaction to Luke in TLJ is any indication, SW fans lose their shit when you do that.

Not to sound douche-y, but a lot of things people in fandom (any fandom really not just SW) have these things they think they want to see, but if they go them, they would lose interest and feels for very fast. I do not think Boba Fett can carry his own show, and I am a Boba Fett fan. Giving him a one-off killer sequence in Mandalorian was great-- but to get that every week? I have my doubts. I hope I am wrong.

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I hear you.

However at the same time Han has been recast, Lando has been recast, Obi-Wan has been recast, Boba Fett has been recast (voices count), Darth Vader has been multiple actors, Leia has been a computer, Luke has now been a computer.

Also, you mention how the DNA of the show will break with changes, yet the show as it exists right now opposes your argument.

There is no sanctity in Star Wars.

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5 hours ago, Spider-Man said:

I hear you.

However at the same time Han has been recast, Lando has been recast, Obi-Wan has been recast, Boba Fett has been recast (voices count), Darth Vader has been multiple actors, Leia has been a computer, Luke has now been a computer.

Also, you mention how the DNA of the show will break with changes, yet the show as it exists right now opposes your argument.

There is no sanctity in Star Wars.

Fett was recast before we ever saw him sans mask. 

Obi-Wan, Solo, and Lando had new actors cast to play the characters at younger ages. That's totally different. This would be somebody else playing a role between Mark Hamill playing Luke in his 20s, and him playing Luke in his 60s. It's like Roseanne having a new Becky, then going back to the old Becky. It just doesn't feel right.

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I think the less I see Luke on live action, the better.  Less is more there.  I'd like to see a CGI Clone Wars style Luke-based series, personally.  But it can be ignored, too.  But on live action, Luke's appearance needs to be an EVENT.

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I’m not sure how recasting a role with a younger actor is totally different from recasting a role with a younger actor. ;-)

I know everyone has likes and dislikes about this entire thing (yay for that) and I also understand the arguments you’re making, Tank. :-)

That said, I still want to see that “Star Wars Christmas List” of things. lol

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Just got HBO Max, so I've been rewatching Rick and Morty. Came across a scene that reminded me of The Mandalorian, so I checked to see if anyone else had already made the same connection. Naturally, YouTubers did not disappoint.

Rick and Morty dialogue is from S3E2 and is dubbed over an edited version of the last scene of the S2 finale of The Mandalorian.

I swear, sometimes this show is just as prophetic as The Simpsons.

 

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On 12/28/2020 at 10:04 PM, Spider-Man said:

I’m not sure how recasting a role with a younger actor is totally different from recasting a role with a younger actor. ;-)

It’s continuity. It’s different to have Obi-Wan looking like Ewan McGregor when he’s young, but Alec Guinness when he’s old, then it is to have Luke be played my Mark Hamil in his 20s, Sebastian Stan in his 30s, then back to Hamil in his 50s/60s.

I am shocked that your level of movie continuity  OCD  would accept that!

 

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32 minutes ago, Tank said:

It’s continuity. It’s different to haveObi-Wan looks like Ewan McGregor when he’s young, but Alec Guinness when he’s old, then it is to have Luke be played my Mark Hamil in his 20s, Sebastian Stan in his 30s, then back to Hamil in his 50s/60s.

I am shocked that your level of movie continuity  OCD  would accept that!

 

As long as they dye his hair the right color, Torch can handle it.

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I've kinda rethought the whole Luke scene and I now really love it. Here is why:

In TLJ Luke famously says "it's time for the Jedi to end". He then gives Rey some reasons as to why. However in this scene here he does things that the old PT era Jedi did and acts alot like the old PT era Jedi acted. We can start with the most obvious. He takes a baby from it's family to train as a Jed. Now I get that Grogu and Mando are not related by blood but clearly by the time of this episode they are family by any definition. The whole saga is in large part about family. Luke's greatest triumph comes because he is attached to his family. Anakin returns from the darkside because of his love and attachment to his son. There is no way you can watch this saga and not come go to the conclusion that taking babies from their families was one of the Jedi's great sins. Hell it's something the First Order also does. Luke should know better than to this child. This is a bad thing Luke does, no doubt.

Next in TPM Mace Windu says "we are keepers of the peace, not soldiers, we can't fight a war for you". Well as we all know the Jedi do indeed fight a war. Beyond that they don't seem to mind it so much. Look at the battle in the arena, look at Anakin and Obi Wan on Greivous' ship. The Jedi kinda seem to enjoy fighting. They clearly as having fun in some of these battles. They fight with flair and style and a showiness. Luke here is quite the same I think. He doesn't seem like some reluctant warrior. He slices through those droids with a hell of a lot of style. Fighting the Clone Wars and becoming overly marshall and violent is what brought the Jedi down.

Then you clearly have Luke showing up here as the hero, as the legend. Notions he scoffs at in TLJ. He's learned by then that showing up with your lightsaber and being violent can only do so much.

This one is a bit more out of universe in a way but the whole way the scene mirrors Vader in Rogue One. Everyone just figures its a cool throwback. But seriously that scene with Vader is the most terror inducing sequence in the entire saga. Making Luke visually resemble that cannot be seen as a good thing. Its showing him as being like his father, when his father was evil.

Really for me the Luke of the ST and TLJ in particular really elevates this whole scene at the end of the Mandalorian. It prevents Luke from being reduced to a deus ex machina who shows up and cuts through some robots and instead makes it a great comparison to the ST Luke. In the ST Luke does make a huge mistake but look after that. He then removes himself from violence. He refuses to fight a war. While away he eventually learns a lesson and then returns and saves everyone while committing ZERO acts of violence. While on this show he saves everyone by doing nothing but committing violence.

In the end it really is great. You have much of fandom thinking "yes this is my Luke. This is what I've always wanted to see. Luke as his peak, in his prime, at his best". When in reality Luke is at his worst. Hes violent and taking a baby from his family (he should know better). 

It really is the most subversive sequence in all of Star Wars.

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I wouldn’t say it’s subversive, it’s consistent. That’s why the ‘talent without training’ line was good, he is displaying the arrogance he references in TLJ.

That’s why I said earlier that both fans of the TLJ Luke and the people who hated that portrayal love the scene. For TLJ lovers, it reinforces the Luke we got - for people didn’t like it, they get the Luke they did want to see. 

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I agree with that. It really does play into Johnson's Luke. In reality that was the kind of scene that Rian was repudiating in TLJ even if the actual scene didn't exist. Now that the scene does exist it really only strengthens Luke in TLJ. 

As far as it being subversive I think that only applies to the people who are more in the "thats the Luke I always to see" camp. They think they are seeing Luke at his best while I think they are seeing him at his worst. Or I guess really on the path to him being at his worst, his worst would obviously be when he ignites the saber over his nephew. 

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I didn’t have an issue with the Dark Troopers like a lot of people did but was thinking the other day how it would have been if they had used some upgraded Battle Droids instead.

Makes more sense since the Empire would probably have some hidden away in storage, the Troopers didn’t end up being anymore impressive than the battle droids anyway and a potential character moment for Mando as well. 

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15 hours ago, The Choc said:

I agree with that. It really does play into Johnson's Luke. In reality that was the kind of scene that Rian was repudiating in TLJ even if the actual scene didn't exist. Now that the scene does exist it really only strengthens Luke in TLJ.

Just like The Clone Wars and Rebels animated series were able to weave a more coherent and enjoyable story around the PT, The Mandalorian is weaving a story around several aspects of the ST. All of this is to soften the blow dealt by the lackluster storytelling in those films.

If Filoni excels at anything, its understanding and translating Lucas' intent. He seems uniquely adept at sifting through the characters and snippets of compelling story that Lucas has in his mind and using that kernel of imagination as the basis for a story worth telling. Add in Favreau's cinematic experience and you have the dream team of live action Star Wars.

None of this was planned though. If Disney had their way, they would have turned this into the MCU and just kept cranking out movies. Even now, it seems as though they still haven't connected the dots. The franchise is not doing well because Star Wars fans all of a sudden prefer television series over movies. Its doing well because of this team that they assembled seemingly by accident.

I hate to be a pessimist here, but I'm not convinced they can duplicate the success of a series run by super nerds, unless they find other super nerds to write and direct those as well.

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19 minutes ago, Darth Kid said:

If Filoni excels at anything, its understanding and translating Lucas' intent. He seems uniquely adept at sifting through the characters and snippets of compelling story that Lucas has in his mind and using that kernel of imagination as the basis for a story worth telling.

It seems incredibly generous to George to give him any credit for these good things we see in the Filoniverse. I mean, sure he created the universe, we can’t deny that, but the creativity here is all Dave’s. 

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I have a hard time myself thinking of these 2 as a dream team. I like this show and enjoyed the 2nd season alot. But really still in alot of ways the season was very much about bringing in characters from other media into this show. Kinda like "hey remember this guy, remember that girl.." They escalated it throughout the season starting with the first episode. The Marshall was a character from a book. A couple weeks later they had Bo Katan, a secondary character from the animated universe. Then upped it to Ahsoka a main character from that animated universe. Then upped it again to Boba Fett and eventually they went as big as you can possibly go with Luke Skywalker. It doesn't take any kind of creative genius to think "hey lets bring Luke back for 5 minutes".

It worked though, the season was very good. Eventually though that well will run dry, there are only so many characters you can bring back in that way and the more you bring them back the less impact it will have anyway.

Really Mandalorian is a show where its like "hey lets hang out in Star Wars for 30-40 minutes." They don't challenge any fans hardcore long held beliefs about what they think or what they want to see. And that is great for this show. When it is only 30-40 minutes 9 times a year. When there are multiple shows going and Star Wars is on 30+ times a year they may have to do more than theyve tried to do in this show.

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Fans are also far far more forgiving of this show than of any of the non OT movies. The miniscule things fans have a problem with in the movies are totally ignored here. I mean Mando gets Gideon's coordinates from the Imperial computer. He then contacts Gideon to tell him he has the coordinates and is coming for him. Gideon is on a ship that can travel at the speed of light. Why doesn't he ya know, just move? If this happened in the movies people would go nuts over it. Here there is nary a word. Which really is a good thing, I hate the little nit picks like this. But we dealt with months of people bitching about how the First Order is dumb for not jumping in front of the resistance but Gideon basically staying and waiting for Mando and company in the same coordinates is fine? Its funny. 

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