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The entire PT should have been ROTS


The Choc
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George Lucas will be remembered (by the public) for Star Wars alone.

 

What about Indy? Lucas didn't direct, but he got writing credit for all Indy movies that have been made so far.

He got STORY credit. Which is very different from witing it.

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Indiana Jones is three of the all-time best at their positions (Lucas as Executive Producer, Spielberg directing and Ford acting) coming together at their peaks.

 

If you want to dismiss Lucas as a writer/director who got lucky with Star Wars that's fair game. But to dismiss what he's done for the film industry as a whole is ludicrous.

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George Lucas will be remembered (by the public) for Star Wars alone.

 

What about Indy? Lucas didn't direct, but he got writing credit for all Indy movies that have been made so far.
He got STORY credit. Which is very different from witing it.

Fair point. All I was trying to say is that while Indy is not the behemoth that Star Wars is, I think Lucas is generally remembered for Indy as well.

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Lucas is a hack. Any positive involvement he's ever had in non SW proves it, and SW itself would have been so much better if he had been less involved.

 

I can see where people have a hard time with it, and want to lionize the guy, but he truly was a one trick pony and is very lucky to be where he is today. If SW hadn't have worked none of us would even know his name.

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You can have personal opinion all you want but to dismiss something he did before Star Wars is plain wrong. He made a movie that that was the third biggest grosser the year it was released, among the top 50 all time when adjusted for inflation, nominated for 5 Oscars and years after it's release was included on several of AFIs 100 anniversary list.

 

That alone makes him incredibly successful in movie making.

 

Tank, you are a writer. How would you like to make a movie that was that successful?

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Guest El Chalupacabra

Just because he created a franchise that has generated $37 billion since 1977, that means exactly dick, and GL is a hack! Rawr!

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You can have personal opinion all you want but to dismiss something he did before Star Wars is plain wrong. He made a movie that that was the third biggest grosser the year it was released, among the top 50 all time when adjusted for inflation, nominated for 5 Oscars and years after it's release was included on several of AFIs 100 anniversary list.

 

That alone makes him incredibly successful in movie making.

 

Tank, you are a writer. How would you like to make a movie that was that successful?

Ohhh no. Don't lump me with Tex. I full acknowledged Lucas' strengths. I also pointed out his weaknesses, and where he took credit for the work others did.

 

I'm not calling him a complete hack, I'm saying he had a period of amazing work in a brief window that he didn't follow through on.

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Rick McCallum only ever worked for Lucas. He announced his retirement a day after George cause he knew no one would ever hire him. That guy was the real villain. A good EP would tell the writer/director they need to step it up but McCallum was a toady yes-man.

 

George could crap on the floor and the next day McCallum would do a BTS video talking about how amazingly smooth and shiny it was.

Disgusting and true all at the same time.

 

Looking at he BTS features for the PT, that really describes McCallum well...and some of his "Junior George Lucas" squad grinning and nodding at his every word.

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You can have personal opinion all you want but to dismiss something he did before Star Wars is plain wrong. He made a movie that that was the third biggest grosser the year it was released, among the top 50 all time when adjusted for inflation, nominated for 5 Oscars and years after it's release was included on several of AFIs 100 anniversary list.

 

That alone makes him incredibly successful in movie making.

 

Tank, you are a writer. How would you like to make a movie that was that successful?

Ohhh no. Don't lump me with Tex. I full acknowledged Lucas' strengths. I also pointed out his weaknesses, and where he took credit for the work others did.

 

I'm not calling him a complete hack, I'm saying he had a period of amazing work in a brief window that he didn't follow through on.

 

Wasn't my intent, just saying as someone in the business that you'd know just how much of an achievement a movie like American Graffiti is.

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For its time, absolutely. It had a verité quality that hadn’t been seen in American cinema before, especially in relation to a specific time and culture. It was the first time the 50s were seen as retro cool. It started a re-surgance in classic rock. It had some subtle, but apt political and social commentary.

 

It also led to the creation of Happy Days, a TV institution.

 

Lucas deserves a lot of credit for that.

 

But not as a writer.

 

And I think the point Tex is making that Lucas has missed more than he’s hit, and if he didn’t have Star Wars on his resume it’s not super likely given his track record that he could have been an institution or filmmaker that had multiple films of note.

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No one is arguing that, I'm not saying when Lucas dies his obit will say "American Graffiti creator dies". Star Wars is why he is a billionaire for sure, no one would deny that. But from what I've read he walked away from Graffiti with 4 million bucks in 1973 money. So he would have been wealthy just from that. He also essentially had the idea for Indiana Jones. You can divy that credit up however you want but the original idea for the character was George's.

 

So ya know he had 3 incredibly successful idea which is 3 more than most people in the business have.

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Indiana Jones is three of the all-time best at their positions (Lucas as Executive Producer, Spielberg directing and Ford acting) coming together at their peaks.

 

If you want to dismiss Lucas as a writer/director who got lucky with Star Wars that's fair game. But to dismiss what he's done for the film industry as a whole is ludicrous.

Another person who I feel deserves credit for Star Wars and Indiana Jones is John Williams. Has anyone ever heard a quote something like ... "You can watch a movie, but music makes you feel a movie." ? I forgot where I heard or read that. Just wondering if anyone knew who originally said that.

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Yeah, half the reason I think Rogue One doesn't hold up to TFA and TLJ is the lack of a Williams score. I've always thought Williams was one of the key ingredients to Star Wars but didn't realise how much it suffers without him until R1.

 

In terms of Lucas, just used Star Wars as a vehicle to push new technologies. He may not be the greatest director or writer but his contributions to filmmaking in general should be recognised. The prequels were still technologically revolutionary - he was the one to really push digital filmmaking, and while the films may have suffered for it, digital probably wouldn't be where it is today without him. (I mean it would of got there anyway, but he really moved it forward)

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Guest El Chalupacabra

Yeah, half the reason I think Rogue One doesn't hold up to TFA and TLJ is the lack of a Williams score. I've always thought Williams was one of the key ingredients to Star Wars but didn't realise how much it suffers without him until R1.

 

I totally agree John Williams' music is iconic, and one of the greatest components of the Star Wars franchise.

 

But I disagree that Rogue One doesn't hold up due to a lack of John Williams. I sincerely think John Williams music will be still played in a 100 years and he will go down as one of the great classical-style composers in history. The R1 score doesn't stand out in the same way a John Williams score would, but honestly, I barely noticed that and was into the movie. While I believe it would have been far better with John Williams, I thought the Rogue One sound track was just fine.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

I'm sure someone could write a program that could create John Williams-style scores for any future Star Wars films, or re-edits of existing films.

Well, any music could probably be written by an algorithm now. Modern pop music pretty much is, anyway. But it is nothing new. Even in the Baroque period, when most music written was a very "mathematical" composition, whenever composers got stuck while writing music, they literally rolled dice to help with writing the next note!

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