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The I've Seen The Last Jedi Thread (spoilers OBV)


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Rant #1

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA. Rey's heritage was something that was played at in TFA. Is there a chance JJ wanted to build it up only for it not to be a big deal? Possibly. It's also possible that Johnson just didn't want to deal with an issue that could divide fans. Snoke was another character that was being built up only to go out like a bitch. Who is Snoke? Nevermind he gone. I'm wondering if JJ were to have done TLJ if he's dead. Phasma was this series Boba Fett sorta. Fett became a legend after going out like a punk. Now I do believe there was never room for Phasma to be more than what she was, but then why cast an actress who is so well known right now? Kind of awkward now that JJ is coming back. If Johnson had advanced the story while doing these things then I would be more forgiving. After two movies I just don't see where this goes. Surprise me please.

Oh and if Luke doesn't want to be bothered, if he doesn't want to be found then why does he leave a map?

 

This makes me wonder....is there someone providing a cohesive vision for all the movies in this trilogy? Or is it up to each director to take the story in the direction that they choose?

The’s a brain trust— Kennedy, Kasdan, Kinbrrg, Abrams, and PRobably a couple others. But they hire writers/directors to bring their vision to it.

 

Abrams said he had read TLJ and loved it back when TFA came out.

 

All that said, it certainly seemed like they had very different agendas.

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Serious question for everybody complaining about how Snoke went out:

 

How in the **** else was he supposed to be defeated? Nobody's answering that question. This mofo can:

 

1) toss around the two other most powerful Force users in the universe like rag dolls

 

2) read your mind so knows your intention to attack before you can do it

 

3) is surrounded by 8 bad assed guards so if you do attack him without him stopping you cold, you'd better somehow finish him off FAST before they jump your ass.

 

How else was he supposed to die? The ONLY way to kill him was to take advantage of his arrogance and use Rey being there to muddy the waters. That was Kylo's one chance in a million and he took advantage of it.

 

So, given his overwhelming power, exactly how else was Snoke supposed to be defeated?

Luke F'in Skywalker. :D

 

I know it's not the movie we got, but I would have liked to seen Luke confront Snoke. Maybe instead of blaming Ben and trying to kill him (which I am fine if they left that scene in the movie), Luke goes after Snoke for turning Ben. Out of guilt, maybe have Luke sacrifice himself to save Ben the way Vader did for Luke. I would like to see Luke just as powerful as Snoke and have a battle using the Force instead of lightsabers. Similar to how Dooku and Yoda fought before their lightsaber duel.

 

It seemed odd that they made Snoke out to be a powerful character, but he couldn't sense Ben's true intentions or a lightsaber moving right next to him. I forgot, why did he have the lightsaber right next to him anyway?

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Rant #1

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA.

Precisely. You could totally tell these two had very different visions. JJ laid groundwork for the series by giving little threads for his successors to follow and explore. Johnson just cut those threads either for shock value or because he wasn't about to explore anything that wasn't his original idea.
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[

 

It seemed odd that they made Snoke out to be a powerful character, but he couldn't sense Ben's true intentions or a lightsaber moving right next to him. I forgot, why did he have the lightsaber right next to him anyway?

It was to parallel ROTJ of course.
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It seemed odd that they made Snoke out to be a powerful character, but he couldn't sense Ben's true intentions or a lightsaber moving right next to him. I forgot, why did he have the lightsaber right next to him anyway?

It was to parallel ROTJ of course.

 

Seems like an occupational hazard to me. :shrug:

 

Luke could have pulled the same trick on the Emperor instead of using the Force to grab his lightsaber.

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Speaking of waking up, is it normal for someone to wake from a coma and walk around a military base with liquids leaking from holes all over his suit? Because as Finn did this, everyone just casually walked by like this is an everyday thing. If Poe is not around to suggest getting him some clothes does he just continue to stumble around everywhere until the liquids run out or something?

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Im at my wifes Office Xmas Party, the drinks and dancing is on and in between the songs my wife started ranting about Star Wars at our table.

 

Sara: Whoever wrote that parody of movie was high as fuck. Is Rian Johnson the alias of Kevin Smith? Its suspicious that he hasnt posted a review on Facebook.

 

More...

 

Sara: First Justice League sucked. Then the Psych reunion sucked. I was so excited for this Star Wars. Im only watching Marvel event films from now on.

 

Afterthought: Im now really nervous for her to read the story Im writing, because admittedly I have already concluded people will think I wrote it while high as fuck. lol

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I'm in shock that people are saying that was the greatest of the SW movies...did we see the same thing? It was okay but it definately wasn't great. I don't even have a desire to go back and see it again.

 

I am so glad Luke and Leia got one final moment on screen together. That made me happy.

 

Please stop with the 'Reylo' term. Don't make me fly to your house and slash your tires.

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Rant #1

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA.

Precisely. You could totally tell these two had very different visions. JJ laid groundwork for the series by giving little threads for his successors to follow and explore. Johnson just cut those threads either for shock value or because he wasn't about to explore anything that wasn't his original idea.

Correction google up JJ Abrams and mystery box. Did you watch Lost? He loves to make up mysteries with no idea what they lead to he sometimes doesnt care and doesnt think it matters. He didnt leave an intricate story in his wake, he left plot danglers. I thought Rian could run with them, but instead, he treated them like a chore.

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Back when the trailer was released I brought up this issue of the perils of having different directors come in to put their own stamp on the franchise without firm leadership at the top. I started it with bringing up Kylos scar and it went the wrong way from there. But I tried to bring it to a close by comparing it to Friday the 13th and stating Lucasfilm needed to make sure the vision was well thought out. Otherwise writers/directors will start doing their own thing, throwing out what they didnt like from a previous entry or ignoring plot points and characterizations set up before. I was actually referring to the future. I never imagined it would happen this badly the second movie in.

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Rant #1

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA.

Precisely. You could totally tell these two had very different visions. JJ laid groundwork for the series by giving little threads for his successors to follow and explore. Johnson just cut those threads either for shock value or because he wasn't about to explore anything that wasn't his original idea.
Correction google up JJ Abrams and mystery box. Did you watch Lost? He loves to make up mysteries with no idea what they lead to he sometimes doesnt care and doesnt think it matters. He didnt leave an intricate story in his wake, he left plot danglers. I thought Rian could run with them, but instead, he treated them like a chore.

Well do you blame him? Maybe he's as sick of JJ ****ing Abrams and his mystery box bs as the rest of us are.

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I just realized something: Shoke's origins are right in front of us. Tank keeps asking "If Snoke is so powerful, where was he when the Emperor reigned?" The answer is: he wasn't that powerful back then. When the Emperor died that left a void on the dark side. The Force demands balance. So after the emperor's death, The Force empowered Snoke to reach that balance. Just as, as stated, when Kylo got more powerful The Force empowered Rey. It's that simple so there's no need for a bunch of backstory about where he was hiding and why didn't the Emperor notice Snoke, etc.

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I think having Luke ignite the saber was the way to go. I always felt from the OT that Obi Wans apparent guilt is just misplaced. He seems to feel this guilt about Anakin but he really didn't do anything wrong. It's more of a generic "I wasn't a good enough master" type thing. Luke actually did something shameful that warrants his guilt and isolation.

 

Some of the other things are just incredible nitpicks. I mean "people don't react well to Finn in the leaking suit" "they didn't tow the ship" these are just silly. The whole "this guy didn't sense this, that guy didn't sense that" those are just rabbit holes, I mean why didn't the Emperor sense Vader's intentions?

 

I get people don't like the movie but I do think when people's initial reaction is negative they just begin to pick apart every little thing and it just feeds this fire of dislike. I mean you think Finn and Rose's mission was boring, I get that it's not the best part of the movie but being mad that BB8 early in the movie seems to have alot of stuff inside of him and then later has room for alot of coins? That's basically insane.

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Saw it a second time with my family, hopeful that my second viewing will change my mind about some things and I'll like it more. Nope. I think I actually dislike this movie more, because the plot holes are more apparent to me now. They're not just nit-picky plot holes, they are major ones: as in rendering the very plot of the movie stupid. My wife was confused, and the more I tried to explain things, the more I realized the plot holes. I went online for answers and instead found more criticisms.

 

The most annoying to me is the fact that some ships have shields, some don't. The big-ass dreadnaught doesn't have shields? Of course not...the script needs the resistance to be able to pick off the ships guns so the bombers can get close amd allow the movie to happen.

 

Distance and weapoms. What..the fleeing resistance ships are the perfect distance away from everything all the time? So position your ships differently! Call for reinforcements so another ship or two appears beside them or in front of them...something. surround them. Can't spare any reinforcements? Fine...like someone's already said on here: hyperspace a few ships that are out of range ahead of them. Problem solved. Of course we are led to believe that none of the first order ships can outrun these resistance ships in the first place. Yes...if only the first Oder had smaller faster tie fighters they could use OH WAIT.

 

Admiral Laura Dern leaving Poe out of the loop with her plan was silly and irresponsible. I guess she felt it more satisfying to show Poe who's boss around here. Yes, THIS is the perfect time for a chain-of-command prick fight, when you're about to all be annihilated. Instead of telling everybody to rely on hope just tell the damn plan already. Need-to-know escape plan... for no reason other than to annoy Poe and scare everyone. Sounds smart.

 

So, the space chase sequence doesn't make enough sense. Strike one.

The casino sequence was both uninteresting and unnecessary. And I love casinos. Strike two.

I did enjoy the Rey-Kylo-Luke stuff, but I still hate what they did to uncle Luke's character, sorry. Foul tip. We're hanging in there.

They screwed up Snoke. Rey's parentage was anticlimactic. The two fun mysteries from TFA...and they screwed it up. Strike three.

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Whats funny to me is that last thing you said. I never thought we'd get any backstory on Snoke and said that on here all the time and I thought Reys parentage would be straightforward. People build these things up in their minds when in fact in alot of ways they aren't mysteries at all. Snoke is not set up as a mystery at all, it's not like characters are saying "we need to know more about Snoke". You built that up in your own mind, from the start I said "Snoke is there for Kylo to kill and take his place." It was obvious they were setting Kylo up as wanting to eclipse Vader, what did Vader claim to want to do on more than one occassion? He wants to overthrow the Emperor and take control himself. I always thought Kylo would accomplish this.

 

As for Reys parentage they do set up a bit of a mystery about it but for the most part it's just obligatory cause of Luke's parentage being such a huge thing and there was really nothing they could do to top that anyway. So why try? Like I said in another thread the single best thing they did was make Rey a nobody.

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Also, don't bombs fall in space in Empire when they are bombing the asteroids to find the Falcon? LOL. That may be it, the dumbest complain I've head. It;s ok for there to be explosions in space and sounds in space and ships to move in space in ways that are completely impossible but bombs falling!!! It's a disaster!!!

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While I would have like to learned about some background about Snoke, I guess it doesn't matter that much. It makes me wonder if I am more critical when viewing these movies as an adult then when I watched the OT as a kid. For example, when I watched ESB in 1980 or ROTJ in 1983, I didn't really know anything about the Emperor other than he was a bad dude and the boss of Darth Vader. It was only when we got the PT that we got some backstory about Palpatine, but there was no backstory in the OT.

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One thing I thought of in regard to Rey's parentage...has anyone stopped to think that the 'vision' of who her parents were was placed there by Snoke? He already admitted planting the other visions. Maybe he felt Rey's origin was worth hiding. I still think there's something there. If there's not, meh. So what.

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While I would have like to learned about some background about Snoke, I guess it doesn't matter that much. It makes me wonder if I am more critical when viewing these movies as an adult then when I watched the OT as a kid. For example, when I watched ESB in 1980 or ROTJ in 1983, I didn't really know anything about the Emperor other than he was a bad dude and the boss of Darth Vader. It was only when we got the PT that we got some backstory about Palpatine, but there was no backstory in the OT.

 

Exactly, the story isn't about Snoke. A movie is not a wikipedia page where you watch it and think "hmm, I want to know more about this stop the movie so I can click on "Snoke" and find out more. That's not how it works. Snoke is a role player, he's in a few scenes of TFA. He's not a main character.

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Choc:

 

I did build Snoke up in my mind. He was just Palpatine 2.0 and I thought there was going to be something different there, or that the lore would be expanded upon. It wasn't. He's not a Jedi or Sith (we think) but what is he? Doesn't matter. He came from the unknown regions of space; that sounds incredible, so that's where it was built up for me. I thought we'd get something new and interesting there.

 

Rey's parents being nobody is fine I guess. It just feels dull to me, but it confused the hell out of my wife. She is not really big star wars fan, and she had the hardest time understanding how Rey could NOT have special parents. Darth Vader was Luke's father, both powerful in the force, and that's how she understood the force. She said, "No, she's too strong she HAS to be somebody's kid, they're tricking her to join the dark side". I said "That's possible, I guess, but Rey seems to have known all along they were nobody".

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