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The I've Seen The Last Jedi Thread (spoilers OBV)


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Quibble: Carrie Fishers sudden death may have seriously derailed plans set in motion for this plot going forward. There is a pivotal moment given to the Vice Admiral which I want to be very critical off, but I am hesitant to given I am (we all are really) completely out of the loop for what those future plans for Leia were. My instinct however is that should have been Leias moment.

 

Gotta strongly disagree based on our missing out on Luke's farewell to Leia if that choice had been made.

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Star Wars - Episode 8: The Last Jedi Good: Rey: Despite referring to Rey as a Mary-Sue in TFA, I found isolating her from the producer's politicized string-pulling leaves a stronger character. Ridley

Best line of the film...   "Do you think you got him?" —General Hux

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Luke would have farewelled earlier, it just would have been an apparent Force Connection instead of a swerve.

 

Shoulda woulda are as slippery as the dark side hole. However everyone knows I was calling for a moment like that for Leia since Force Awakens was announced, so maybe that is why it sticks out so much. Anyway, they could be in quite the bind now. It appears to me that Leia was being set up to teach Rey in the next film.

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I think the reviews will still remain positive, overall. Most of the nerd stuff people like me are b*tching about usually won't be what the critics worry about. But I do think the slow middle at space Las Vegas and the even slower hyperspace chase with the big plot hole of the First Order not sending ships to head the Resistance off in a pincer movement does hurt the story enough where some braver, more independent critics will take it to task somewhat.

 

No matter what, TLJ will still make a buttload of money. http://www.boxofficemojo.com/

 

And that is what is important, right? RIGHT?! :eek:

 

I don't think you can call this a plothole, I mean bad guys in movies make bad decisions all the time. If every time bad guys made a mistake that allows good guys to survive is some plothole then I mean geez.

 

Is it a plothole that Vader didn't have the hyperdrive on the Falcon totally removed rather than just turned off?

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Had it been one sequence it would have been fine. To be 2/3rds of the movie pushes it to the brink of being silly-- especially when they show us that the Falcon and Finn/Rose/DJ can hyperspace in and insert themselves somewhere very specific. Had the film not told us such things were possible, it wouldn't make the situation so silly.

 

Honestly, they could have just as easily done a nebula or asteroid field.

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Just back from the movie theater. Haven't read the previous pages yet so sorry for any redundancies.

 

* I loved the Luke Skywalker scenes....until it was revealed his entire Big Scene from showing up to inspire the resistance, have his moment with Leia and confront Kylo Ren was all just one big illusion that used up his Force energy. This was my chance to see Luke Skywalker, Jedi Master. And it was all a ....dream. Nice double-sun scene to look at before he disappeared, though.

* Leia being blown out of the ship was shocking. I thought, "Oh well, that's how they handle it". Then she shocked me thoroughly by doing wacky flying through space. I've believed since I saw TFA that Leia was going to redeem Kylo Ren the way Luke redeemed Vader. Then Carrie died and now I don't know what they're doing.

* Great Yoda scene. I really want all the Force ghosts to pester Kylo Ren in the next movie. Wherever he goes there's Luke, Yoda or Ewan McGregor following him around, bugging him.

* What was the whole reason for that idiotic gambling planet trip? It was a huge waste of time. I thought, "Oh, here's where Lando shows up". But all we get is Benicio del Toro. And Maz Kanata skyping.

* And Captain Phasma is still the overhyped sequels version of Boba Fett. She brought nothing to this film.

* Hey, Admiral Laura Dern....since you're committing suicide by staying behind anyway, why didn't you just turn that big honkin' ship of yours sideways to provide cover for the transports after the first couple of them went down?

* Poe, Poe, Poe. You disobey authority and get demoted, you disobey it again only to be wrong and cause lots of things to fall apart, then you "redeem" yourself by assuming that the Luke Skywalker which turned out to be a Force illusion must have found a way into the base so there has to be a physical way out. Moral luck, buddy, that those dogs led the way and everybody else survived.

* DANG...no story behind Snoke then? He's there one minute, then a bisected Sith the next.

* I just can't take Hux seriously....ever. Is that supposed to be the point?

 

All in all, not the worst SW film ever, but it's not TESB of this series.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

Had it been one sequence it would have been fine. To be 2/3rds of the movie pushes it to the brink of being silly-- especially when they show us that the Falcon and Finn/Rose/DJ can hyperspace in and insert themselves somewhere very specific. Had the film not told us such things were possible, it wouldn't make the situation so silly.

 

Honestly, they could have just as easily done a nebula or asteroid field.

[sam Elliott Voice] Tank is G** Damn right! [/sam Elliott Voice]

 

While watching the movie, hiding in a nebula literally was my first thought when I realized they should have done something different because the "chase" was going on too long.

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Sooo I thought it was...okay? I think I liked it a little less than TFA, I would put it in somewhere in the PT ratings. Luke and Chewie were the highlights of the movie for me.

 

Likes!

 

Luke! I liked his cranky old Jedi and he was a total badass in his face off with Kylo. I loved how in awe everyone was as he walked by.

Chewie and the Porgs.

The hyperspace suicide jump. Although Hera already did a similar stunt in Rebels without dying. :p

Yoda showing up to dole out some more sage advice for Luke.

Kylo pulling a fast one on Snoke.

The Hardware Wars joke they snuck in there. At least, I'm pretty sure it was, anyway.

Luke passing. I just know he'll be a Force ghost next movie!

Leia and Chewie finally get a hug!

 

Dislikes!

 

Luke pulling his saber on young Ben. Is this the same guy that was pulling for Vader to be redeemed when literally everyone else thought that was impossible? Ugh.

The casino scene was completely pointless.

On that same note, Finn and Rose going on pretty much a holiday getaway while the fleet is being sloooooowly pursued. You can't tell me they couldn't have launched a bunch of Tie Fighters to cut them off. "Let's wait until they run out of gas, ho ho!" Worst chase scene ever. :|

R2 gets one scene. What the heck.

Snoke getting punked before we find out anything at all about him. Unless they plan on going into it next movie, which I doubt. He must have been around during the OT since he seems fairly old. Was he a Sith in hiding? Did he decide to take over what was left of the Empire when Palpatine and Vader were killed? Am I expected to read some future random novel/comic to find these answers? Eh.

Rey/Kylo team up. She goes from hating his guts to I think he can be redeemed pretty fast. Little interesting considering she barely knows him and what she does know about (killed Han, working with FO) isn't what I would call potential BFF material.

So that one fleet is the entire FO? Are they really supposed to be a galactic threat?

Leia's spacewalk. I just...ehhh. It didn't work for me. I thought they had decided to kill her off early in the movie due to Carrie's real life passing and was surprised she survived.

A lot of the jokes were just not that funny. It was like someone's dad wrote them.

"There must be another way out, Skywalker got in here somehow!" About that...Well, when in doubt, follow the Lothcats or whatever.

Still no Lando!

It kind of felt like I was watching ESB except in reverse.

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Honestly, they could have just as easily done a nebula or asteroid field.

 

They could have done anything to make it exciting really. I mean, they lifted the broad structure of The Empire Strikes Back. One training sequence and one chase sequence. Bring the both together at the end.

 

The Millennium Falcon chase sequence easily stands out today. They gave it multiple stages, alternating between high excitement and quiet character development with no issue. Here they are, almost 40 years later and can do almost anything they can imagine, and the best they can come up with is everyone going in a straight line and waiting for them to run out of gas with the occasional blaster fired off just to remind them they're there as they talk about things. Battlestar Galactica had basically the same premise in its first episode and spun it into something much better.

 

To me, that's easily the most glaring flaw of the movie. And that's not something you can blame Abrams for, it was just... lazy.

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I mean there are 1,000 things the First Order could have done. It didn't bother me at all. In fact it worked well in that it was the whole Resistance rather than a few characters and they were facing impending doom with no available respite.

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While we're complaining about parts of the movie. I literally said out loud "Where did that come from?" when Rose declared her love for Finn and kissed him before faux dying. Aside from some fangirling, I didn't see anything from Rose that led me to believe that's where this was going. Rey and Ben, sure. They were all intimate in each other's minds and talking with the only person who could relate, but Rose and Finn? Nah. Nuddin'.

 

But, I suppose after waking up from a coma where he went on a suicide mission to save Rey and the first thing he asked about was her, one random, unearned confession of love is enough for Finn just to completely forget about his unrequited Rey obsession and ignore her when she finally comes back.

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For the record I rank TLJ with the Prequels and below all of the others, including TFA, exact order I cant give shits to think of... except A New Hope is still my favorite.

 

I am shocked that TLJs spinning plot got passed rewrites and that the chase wasnt seen as totally laughable if not even a parody like set up.

 

I am annoyed that a major emotional moment and conflict with Poe was given to a purple haired lady that the story made no effort for me to give a shit about... and then sidelined Leia for purple haired lady because because. Even after that moment (on Salt World) it was like Leia was already dead anyway, so I just cant let go of how the Hyperspace Sacrifice and Poe conflict should have been hers. It really feels like someone got cold feet somewhere along the writing/production process.

 

I liked that Snoke was punked, I disliked the POM Marketing Security Guards.

 

I like that Luke was vain and de-aged himself for his swerve appearance.

 

I have no problem with moving away from anything people loved in books or whatever, tearing down old and trying for new... but the more I think about the film the more I think there was some really conflicting opinions in the creative process. The movie is a mess, like a cake thats dropped but when you pick it up some frosting gets on your fingers and youre like wow that tastes amazing.

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​Originally posted by Poe Dameron:

 

 

"While we're complaining about parts of the movie. I literally said out loud "Where did that come from?" when Rose declared her love for Finn and kissed him before faux dying. Aside from some fangirling, I didn't see anything from Rose that led me to believe that's where this was going. Rey and Ben, sure. They were all intimate in each other's minds and talking with the only person who could relate, but Rose and Finn? Nah. Nuddin'."

To say nothing of how she injured herself severely and destroyed her craft just to save one person who was about to sacrifice his life to give the resistance the chance to get away. As a result of her interference, Luke Skywalker sacrificed himself. When you join an organization like the Rebel Alliance (et al), there are times in which lives will be lost or sacrifices will be made. By valuing the needs of the one over the needs of the many, she nearly cost the rest of her allies, including General Organa, their lives.

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The more I think about this film the more I get annoyed with it.

 

I dont mind seeing struggle in heroes, in fact I think it is crucial, but this...

 

Im Luke Sywalker, I wont kill my mass murdering father because because.

 

Im Luke Skywalker, my nephew just had a bad dream so I must murder him.

 

Im Princess Leia, you might remember me as the other that Yoda spoke about or from a blue hologram. Guess what? Im a badass Force user now, for a minute anyway because because.

 

Im Poe Whathisface, I heard you guys liked me in the last film. Well, Im going to become a complete tool because because.

 

Im Phasma, I still do nothing.

 

Im Hux and I sux.

 

Im Snoke and I get poked, Boba Fett has more screen time than me.

 

Im Antonio Banderas and Im not in this film, but there is no reason for Benicio to be in the film either.

 

Im Bombs and I fall in space.

 

Im Rey Nobi-Wan and I magically leave an exploded Star Destroyer and appear in the Falcon because because.

 

Im the Star Destroyer, I apparently dont have engines or whatever, or fighters that can go past three hundred yards... never mind that Vaders tie and Lukes Xwing flew everywhere and never once did anyone wonder where the nearest Shell Station was.

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Rant #1

 

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA. Rey's heritage was something that was played at in TFA. Is there a chance JJ wanted to build it up only for it not to be a big deal? Possibly. It's also possible that Johnson just didn't want to deal with an issue that could divide fans. Snoke was another character that was being built up only to go out like a bitch. Who is Snoke? Nevermind he gone. I'm wondering if JJ were to have done TLJ if he's dead. Phasma was this series Boba Fett sorta. Fett became a legend after going out like a punk. Now I do believe there was never room for Phasma to be more than what she was, but then why cast an actress who is so well known right now? Kind of awkward now that JJ is coming back. If Johnson had advanced the story while doing these things then I would be more forgiving. After two movies I just don't see where this goes. Surprise me please.

 

Oh and if Luke doesn't want to be bothered, if he doesn't want to be found then why does he leave a map?

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Guest El Chalupacabra

While we're complaining about parts of the movie. I literally said out loud "Where did that come from?" when Rose declared her love for Finn and kissed him before faux dying. Aside from some fangirling, I didn't see anything from Rose that led me to believe that's where this was going. Rey and Ben, sure. They were all intimate in each other's minds and talking with the only person who could relate, but Rose and Finn? Nah. Nuddin'.

 

But, I suppose after waking up from a coma where he went on a suicide mission to save Rey and the first thing he asked about was her, one random, unearned confession of love is enough for Finn just to completely forget about his unrequited Rey obsession and ignore her when she finally comes back.

If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with!

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Rant #1

 

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA. Rey's heritage was something that was played at in TFA. Is there a chance JJ wanted to build it up only for it not to be a big deal? Possibly. It's also possible that Johnson just didn't want to deal with an issue that could divide fans. Snoke was another character that was being built up only to go out like a bitch. Who is Snoke? Nevermind he gone. I'm wondering if JJ were to have done TLJ if he's dead. Phasma was this series Boba Fett sorta. Fett became a legend after going out like a punk. Now I do believe there was never room for Phasma to be more than what she was, but then why cast an actress who is so well known right now? Kind of awkward now that JJ is coming back. If Johnson had advanced the story while doing these things then I would be more forgiving. After two movies I just don't see where this goes. Surprise me please.

 

Oh and if Luke doesn't want to be bothered, if he doesn't want to be found then why does he leave a map?

Thats what I basically said in the E9 thread.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

Rant #1

 

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA. Rey's heritage was something that was played at in TFA. Is there a chance JJ wanted to build it up only for it not to be a big deal? Possibly. It's also possible that Johnson just didn't want to deal with an issue that could divide fans. Snoke was another character that was being built up only to go out like a bitch. Who is Snoke? Nevermind he gone. I'm wondering if JJ were to have done TLJ if he's dead. Phasma was this series Boba Fett sorta. Fett became a legend after going out like a punk. Now I do believe there was never room for Phasma to be more than what she was, but then why cast an actress who is so well known right now? Kind of awkward now that JJ is coming back. If Johnson had advanced the story while doing these things then I would be more forgiving. After two movies I just don't see where this goes. Surprise me please.

 

Oh and if Luke doesn't want to be bothered, if he doesn't want to be found then why does he leave a map?

After seeing the movie, and then learning JJ was coming back, my first thought was "JJ must have been really pissed about TLJ." I'd like to know if those two had words, or if JJ wend directly to Kathleen Kennedy to tell her amateur hour is over, and she need to put him back in. Not that JJ is THAT much better, but you are right...if you are going to succeed someone else's movie with a sequel, at least write it like it is part of the same story!

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Rant #1

 

Rian Johnson and JJ Abrams WERE NOT on the same page. They weren't in the same book! Johnson seemed to want to undo everything that was started in TFA. Rey's heritage was something that was played at in TFA. Is there a chance JJ wanted to build it up only for it not to be a big deal? Possibly. It's also possible that Johnson just didn't want to deal with an issue that could divide fans. Snoke was another character that was being built up only to go out like a bitch. Who is Snoke? Nevermind he gone. I'm wondering if JJ were to have done TLJ if he's dead. Phasma was this series Boba Fett sorta. Fett became a legend after going out like a punk. Now I do believe there was never room for Phasma to be more than what she was, but then why cast an actress who is so well known right now? Kind of awkward now that JJ is coming back. If Johnson had advanced the story while doing these things then I would be more forgiving. After two movies I just don't see where this goes. Surprise me please.

 

Oh and if Luke doesn't want to be bothered, if he doesn't want to be found then why does he leave a map?

This makes me wonder....is there someone providing a cohesive vision for all the movies in this trilogy? Or is it up to each director to take the story in the direction that they choose?

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Im Bombs and I fall in space.

I'm so glad I'm not the only one that was annoyed by that. I don't get into physics in sci fi fantasy movies, but that irked me.

 

This one didn't seem like a big deal to me. They could have been given an initial push in a certain direction. It seems silly to have "bombers" anyway, but I did like how they looked like WWII bombers.

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Rant #2

 

Holdo's "secret plan" was doomed to fail. Get to Crait, unload everyone off. Okay, but why is that a secret? Your secret causes a mutiny. Not only that, your plan to get everyone on the surface of Crait fails if Luke Skywalker and Rey don't show up. You didn't plan that. It might have been all she had and as a leader she had to sell it to the others.

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Serious question for everybody complaining about how Snoke went out:

 

How in the fuck else was he supposed to be defeated? Nobody's answering that question. This mofo can:

 

1) toss around the two other most powerful Force users in the universe like rag dolls

 

2) read your mind so knows your intention to attack before you can do it

 

3) is surrounded by 8 bad assed guards so if you do attack him without him stopping you cold, you'd better somehow finish him off FAST before they jump your ass.

 

How else was he supposed to die? The ONLY way to kill him was to take advantage of his arrogance and use Rey being there to muddy the waters. That was Kylo's one chance in a million and he took advantage of it.

 

So, given his overwhelming power, exactly how else was Snoke supposed to be defeated?

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