The I've Seen The Last Jedi Thread (spoilers OBV)

[Ryn]

 

Question (that may have been answered already). If Kylo didn't know about Rey until the events of TFA, and TLJ takes place immediately after, how did he have time to track her down and find out her backstory?

Good question. In the TFA novel when Rey takes the lighstaber after Kylo nearly killed Finn:

 

Rey appeared equally shocked that her reach for the device had exceeded his. She gazed down at the weapon now resting in her grip.

 

"It is you," Ren murmured.

 

His words unsettled her: Not for the first time, he seemed to know more about her than she did about herself.

 

Snoke explains this in his "Darkness rises, and light to meet it" bit. That he warned of another to match Ren's power.

 

Actually, so much of what was set up in TFA as apparently important was answered by Johnson in TLJ. Just not what many fans wanted to see. (In my opinion, he redeems almost everything I dislike about TFA, one of my least favorite of them all.) The seeming disconnect people think between the two films reminds me a lot of the comic series, The Kamandi Challenge:

 

Born from the mind of Jack “King” Kirby, the post apocalyptic Earth of Kamandi has been a fan favorite for decades, and now 14 intrepid teams of writers and artists build on this incredible foundation and take the title character on an epic quest to find his long-lost parents and travel to places seen and unseen in the DC Universe.

 

Each issue will end with an unimaginable cliffhanger, and it’s up to the next creative team to resolve it before creating their own.

[Lord Darth Hunter]

That was one of the main criticisms of the PT; Lucas wrote each as he went along. The movies would've come out better had he had all three well thought out before filming began. Now we are getting the same with the ST and it shows.

[Ryn]

All the trilogies were written that way. Except for Lucas' original 9/12 episode outline, there has been no specific guidance.

[ShadowDog]

The Nolan Batman trilogy was done the same way and that worked out 66% of the time.

[Lord Darth Hunter]

The Matrix trilogy didn't work after the first.

All the trilogies were written that way. Except for Lucas' original 9/12 episode outline, there has been no specific guidance.

Hence why we got the repeat Death Star plot for ROTJ. But you can't count the OT as having been "written that way." When Lucas made ANH he was getting snickered at by everyone in Hollywood, including some of the very people in the movie. No one had any idea the major hit it would become, especially GL. So he tried to make as best a standalone movie as he could, hoping that he could at least make enough money to pay back everyone he was in debt to. Once ANH blew up, he could go on to make the rest of the trilogy. But even after that initial success, ESB was still a major risk, especially since it's a movie that doesn't have an ending! It's not like today, where no matter how badly WB has screwed up the DC Universe and how much money Justice League lost, they will continue to crank those out, reboot everything if they have to. GL didn't have that luxury. If he messed up back then he might never get another shot.

Now once the PT rolled around, everyone knew damn well those were going to print money. There was no danger in thinking, shoot, if Episode I doesn't do well I won't be able to make II and III. The same can be said of the ST. So it's unfair to compare their situations to the OT.

[Guest Robin]

I am not sure there is anything wrong with writing sequels without some grand plan. In example, there was no plan for Treks 2, 3 and 4 and yet it seems that way because the writers wrote each film to fit together. Disregarding financial woes, pressures or anything like that, just talking creatively... I think issues arise when writers fall in and out of love with certain elements and characters, or just prefer certain types of stories. I think that love/hate/preference is what comes across on film. Combine that with an audiences own imagination, expectation for a sequel and it is actually pretty surprising to me that sequels work as often as they do (which I guess isnt even that often).

[Metropolis]

Anyone find it weird that Luke didn't know that Han was dead? I might have missed that earlier in the thread.

[Guest Robin]

Yes.

 

Its also weird that Lukes motavation was to destroy the past, let the Jedi die but he just sat on that island with all its history intact for a decade and also left a treasure map behind so people could find him.

[Lord Darth Hunter]

"Not my Luke Skywalker."

 

Thank you Mark Hamill.

[Tank]

Luke had shut the Force out so he didnt feel tremors when his friend died. Its also what kept Kylo from finding him.

 

Luke didnt leave a map to himself, he HAD a map to the first Jedi Temple that others put together using a piece still in Lukes navigators memory.

[Metropolis]

Oh yeah. The shutting the force off thing. Forgot about that.

 

I never thought that Luke himself had a map. Han says that Luke went looking for the first Jedi Temple. I thought people just went from that info trying to find it where that was.

 

Sidenote: we had rotisserie chicken last night and my first thought when I looked at it was "I wonder if this is what Porg tastes like." Unlike Chewie I ate it.

[Mara Jade Skywalker]

My favorite thing about people taking out of context quotes from Mark Hamill to prove he doesn't like the movie is...

 

Oh wait, I don't like anything about that.

[Metropolis]

I don't like the movie. I don't need anything to prove why I didn't like it. The Luke thing was something that popped into my head so I asked. I've only seen it once.

 

There are parts of the movie that I really like. As a whole I walked out of the theater disappointed left wondering how in God's Earth they are going to wrap this up. I've never deviated from that stance. I have a co-worker who complained about this and that and said he gave the movie a 7 out of 10.

[Lord Darth Hunter]

Whatever context Hamill was quoted in, it works for me. This trilogy is now like the kid who starts getting bad grades, doing drugs and joins a gang, and his mom is out there confronting the gang members and bailing the kid out of jail and trying to bring him back home. Meanwhile the kid's dad and uncle are at the bar having drinks while watching Monday Night Football.

 

"Not my Luke Skywalker."

[ShadowDog]

I don't like the movie. I don't need anything to prove why I didn't like it.

 

Pronoun game. She meant Mark not liking it, not you.

[Metropolis]

Oh. Sorry then Mara.

[Tank]

Whatever context Hamill was quoted in, it works for me. This trilogy is now like the kid who starts getting bad grades, doing drugs and joins a gang, and his mom is out there confronting the gang members and bailing the kid out of jail and trying to bring him back home. Meanwhile the kid's dad and uncle are at the bar having drinks while watching Monday Night Football.

 

"Not my Luke Skywalker."

"Everything you just said is wrong." --Luke Skywalker

[The Choc]

The Matrix trilogy didn't work after the first.

 

All the trilogies were written that way. Except for Lucas' original 9/12 episode outline, there has been no specific guidance.

Hence why we got the repeat Death Star plot for ROTJ. But you can't count the OT as having been "written that way." When Lucas made ANH he was getting snickered at by everyone in Hollywood, including some of the very people in the movie. No one had any idea the major hit it would become, especially GL. So he tried to make as best a standalone movie as he could, hoping that he could at least make enough money to pay back everyone he was in debt to. Once ANH blew up, he could go on to make the rest of the trilogy. But even after that initial success, ESB was still a major risk, especially since it's a movie that doesn't have an ending! It's not like today, where no matter how badly WB has screwed up the DC Universe and how much money Justice League lost, they will continue to crank those out, reboot everything if they have to. GL didn't have that luxury. If he messed up back then he might never get another shot.

 

Now once the PT rolled around, everyone knew damn well those were going to print money. There was no danger in thinking, shoot, if Episode I doesn't do well I won't be able to make II and III. The same can be said of the ST. So it's unfair to compare their situations to the OT.

 

Also, hence how we got "No, I am your father"

[Tank]

You can loosely plot a series of films, but the process of making one, from page one of the script to the make the last edit in post is an organic process. Things change at all steps along the way, some things end up impossible to pull off, you get new ideas on set, and you can't forsee any of that in advance.

 

Invariably, the second story would be effected by changes made in making the first-- that's just how it goes. I agree, a bit of loose plotting would help. But the more details you plan ahead, the more of a box you put yourself in.

[Lord Darth Hunter]

 

The Matrix trilogy didn't work after the first.

 

 

All the trilogies were written that way. Except for Lucas' original 9/12 episode outline, there has been no specific guidance.

 

Hence why we got the repeat Death Star plot for ROTJ. But you can't count the OT as having been "written that way." When Lucas made ANH he was getting snickered at by everyone in Hollywood, including some of the very people in the movie. No one had any idea the major hit it would become, especially GL. So he tried to make as best a standalone movie as he could, hoping that he could at least make enough money to pay back everyone he was in debt to. Once ANH blew up, he could go on to make the rest of the trilogy. But even after that initial success, ESB was still a major risk, especially since it's a movie that doesn't have an ending! It's not like today, where no matter how badly WB has screwed up the DC Universe and how much money Justice League lost, they will continue to crank those out, reboot everything if they have to. GL didn't have that luxury. If he messed up back then he might never get another shot.

Now once the PT rolled around, everyone knew damn well those were going to print money. There was no danger in thinking, shoot, if Episode I doesn't do well I won't be able to make II and III. The same can be said of the ST. So it's unfair to compare their situations to the OT.

Also, hence how we got "No, I am your father"

 

 

Now we got the straight out of Spaceballs shot of the ironing board.

[The Choc]

Yes, cause that detail is something that would have been planned out from the outset. On a big whiteboard "no showing laundry".

[Lord Darth Hunter]

Comb the desert!!!

 

I wonder if the ring Rose gave the kids works like the one given to Lone Star.

[The Choc]

It's amazing to me the things that bother people, its like a 5 second shot. I'm not saying you are wrong to not like it, but it just has zero affect on my opinion of the movie for good or bad.

[Lord Darth Hunter]

Oh yeah, I get it. You loved the movie. I know those of us who hated it are not going to change your mind about it. It's the PT debate all over again.

 

I brought the ironing gag because my wife is watching Total Divas and there was a segment where the wrestlers are ironing their goofy outfits. I never thought watching that would make me think of a Star Wars movie.

[The Choc]

Ofcourse, nor I am going to change your mind. But if we aren't going to discuss those things we disagree about may as well stop posting here.