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EPISODE VIII - THE LAST JEDI


Mara Jade Skywalker
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It's about Kylo. Even if Luke felt he shoimukd have feared Palpatine more it's not like it would be some great regret. That confrontation worked out as well as possible.

 

On the other hand what happened with his nephew would be a huge regret for him and something he doesn't want repeated.

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lol at everyone rationalizing the Luke line every possible way.

 

K.I.S.S.

This trailer was really good. However, all of the misdirection is annoying...especially done multiple times in one trailer. It feels gimmicky. TFA trailer #1 is perfect. It didn't need misdirection to cause a buzz.

It didn't need anything to cause a buzz.

 

Misdirection is fine. Keep the plot details as under wraps as possible. Show me cool shit and misdirect away.

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I think there is misdirection in terms of specific scenes. However I feel the general points of Kylo trying to gain power, Rey searching for guidance and Luke's fear of training Rey are all true. Basically I think the misdirection is there to highlight the actual themes of the movie.

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I want to see Rey and Kylo switch teams in the last act of VII. Rey gets tired of Luke's grouchy cynicism and Kylo gets pissed off that Snoke made him kill his dad. Have them both team up by meeting in the middle grey area in IX.

What does "grey area" even mean? They use kewl dark side powers, but for good? They use diet dark side powers? What?

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I want to see Rey and Kylo switch teams in the last act of VII. Rey gets tired of Luke's grouchy cynicism and Kylo gets pissed off that Snoke made him kill his dad. Have them both team up by meeting in the middle grey area in IX.

 

What does "grey area" even mean? They use kewl dark side powers, but for good? They use diet dark side powers? What?

Dark side gains access to force lightning, force choke, and horror. Light side gets stun droid, stasis field, and force heal. Grey Jedi can only use the standard force push, knight speed, amd throw lightsaber.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

Luke's line about raw strength and seeing it only once before is about Yoda. It's a direct reference to Empire when he's beginning training with Yoda and he says "I'm NOT afraid" and Yoda looks at him as though he's a child, the lighting goes slightly more red and he says "you WILL be... Yeah... you. WILL. BE. " and it's tense as ****.

Well he also says (assuming its all the same phrase and not spliced) that he wasn't afraid, and should have been (paraphrase). I think he was talking about Kylo, because he goes on to turn on Luke and destroy the Jedi Temple.

 

 

 

I find it totally unlikely that a half-trained Kylo Ren was superior to Luke several years ago.

Maybe, but he had help. And I really don't see where we ever get the idea that Luke is a powerful Jedi. He played it right in the OT, but he's a sort of half-trained Jedi who flirts with the darkside and wins the day, but is he a great Jedi? Is he that powerful? I don't think there's anything in the movies that definitely supports that. Maybe Kylo has more raw power than Luke.

 

The fact that he defeats Vader indicates he is at least Darth Vader level of power, who even in the suit was able to defeat Jedi Masters with years of training. And if Lucas can still be believed, Vader was 80% the power of the Emperor.

 

But I agree, Luke may not be at Legends level powers. Indeed, there is nothing that says Luke is the most powerful jedi, either. So I do somewhat agree with you, there. It could be that Luke is not powerful enough to defeat Snoke, or Kylo for that matter. Which could explain why he has to train Rey, who is at their level.

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Luke's line about raw strength and seeing it only once before is about Yoda. It's a direct reference to Empire when he's beginning training with Yoda and he says "I'm NOT afraid" and Yoda looks at him as though he's a child, the lighting goes slightly more red and he says "you WILL be... Yeah... you. WILL. BE. " and it's tense as ****.

Well he also says (assuming its all the same phrase and not spliced) that he wasn't afraid, and should have been (paraphrase). I think he was talking about Kylo, because he goes on to turn on Luke and destroy the Jedi Temple.

 

Yeah definitely talking about Kylo. Vader, Palpatine and Yoda were all extremely powerful but not raw or untamed power as referenced in the trailer. They had full control. Kylo didn't scare him before because it wasn't anything he was used to dealing with.

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"i've seen this kind of raw strength only once before . . . . . it didn't scare me enough then; it does now."

 

There are two ways to look at this. One, he's speaking as a teacher and his experiences of raw strength. If you accept the visual cue of the trailer (and I find trailers nowadays are usually trying to misdirect you), the "now" is Rey. So the "before" is Kylo. Definitely believable and fits the KiSS model.

 

It just seems odd to me for Luke to say he's only seen raw strength like Kylo's once before when he faced Vader and Palpatine.

It seems as logical to me that "before" is referencing the OT (when there were all kinds of mentions of him not being afraid), so then he's talking about either Vader, Palpatine, both, The Empire, or Yoda (doubt it).

So the "now" is Kylo, Snoke, both, The First Order, or Rey (doubt it).

But maybe that underestimates the use of the word "raw". Maybe he thinks Vader and Palpatine were well-done or at least medium-rare strength.

We will find out soon enough.

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