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The I've Seen Rogue One Thread (spoilers OBV)


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It's been confirmed it's Mustafar by that Pablo guy, but I don't get why there was no title card. That was odd. . .and really inconsistent with the style they were going for.

They didn't give it a title card cause it would confirm the PT happen. Lucasfilm policy is to neither confirm nor deny the PT. ;P

 

This film is Star Wars Episode 3.5 in my book.

Which raises the question. The debate of what order to watch the films in if you're new now gets interesting. Indeed this slots in right before ANH, but it's so tonally and visually different from the the OT and PT that it would seem odd to watch it between them. Even more than the prequels I feel like a lot of this movie is presented knowing the audience is aware of what comes next.

 

I did like that Cassian was sort of a bad person in some ways. Hey, running a Rebellion is dirty business. I've no clue why he shot up Saw Gerrera's guy though. I must have missed something there. Any help guys? But it is nice to note that you can't overthrow a government without employing agents that get their hands dirty and that they have to live with it as well.

My biggest, (and frankly the only real) complaint about the movie is that it's tone is all over the place. Cassian's arc, as you point out, paints him as less than a nobel hero. While I appreciated it, and thought it was great for the character, it really threw off the tone of the movie. These shades of gray are new to Star Wars, which is generally painted in very simplistic terms.

 

This was more grounded-- which again I liked, but it made me feel like something was off. It didn't help that Whittaker and Mendelsohn were chewing the scenery and uncomfortably over the top. Their performances would actually fit in the OT, and most definitely the PT because of the operatic tone and style. When you make things more grounded, acting like that suddenly sticks out.

 

As much as I liked the movie, because of this, it didn't give me the big feels the way that TFA did. I think this is a better plotted, possibly even a better written movie than TFA, but it didn't have the same feel and emotional kick that TFA did.

 

Oh, and I'm wondering what's up with the need to change the model of the Mon Calamari.

Twileks come in lots of colors, why not Mon Cals? These ones also seemed to be a lot more blubbery too...

 

Right now it's my 4th fave behind TFA and the OT.

Soooooo, you mean 5th?

 

Guess we have to do it:

 

 

ESB

ANH

ROTJ=TFA=R1

ROTS

TPM

AOTC

 

I loved all the lore it created, especially for the Rebellion. Seeing Yavin again was amazing. I loved Mon Mothma and Bail Organa - that was what I wanted from the prequels.

Totally agree. I liked how they made the temples less Mayan, but not so different they no longer resembled what we see in ANH.

 

Vader, though...whoo boy. He was fan freakin tastic. That scene at the end was worth the price of admission. Amazing. Wonderful. And AH HIS CASTLE.

Yeah, Vader was worth the price of admission alone. I found the re-creation of the ANH costume really distracting though. Despite Rebels beating them to the punch a bit with actually giving us a Vader with modern FX behind his power, it was still awesome to see it in live action. It was one of those moments we've always wanted. Also, I think it really helps keep Vader in the top 5 movie villains of all time for modern audiences.

 

I am so, so glad that everyone died. They didn't wuss out like they did with Ahsoka. I just hope this means Rebels won't try to pull the same **** with Kanan and Ezra.

That's purely a Dave Filoni problem. He admits it.

 

So yeah-- most everyone has covered what I was going to say. I thought it was a lot of fun, and outside of my struggles with the tone (see above) and some of the easter eggs (see below), I didn't have too many issues with it. I walked out pretty happy-- despite not being moved. But that's a tall order for any movie, really.

 

At its worst moments it felt like the biggest budget fanfilm ever, at it's best, it was astonishingly better than half of the SW movies in existence.

 

Visually, I thought it was great. I had talked about TFA rightly updating the cinematography style of the saga, it needed to happen. They certainly follow suit here, but, again, this would make it odd to watch in chronological order with ANH.

 

I didn't like the title cards or lack of a crawl. Just saying.

 

And I'll incur the wrath of Walt... and no one else has brought this up yet-- but I thought the only thing that was truly bad about this movie was the music. It was terrible and on the nose. I don't know if this is because it was recycle Williams on top of one composer that got fired on top of a third that stepped in-- but I found it to be uninspiring and forced at every turn. Nothing iconic about it.

 

Easter egg / cameo report--

 

Loved:

Bail Organa-- a PT actor redeeming their character!

Tarkin and Leia, despite looking a bit off. Their absence would have been a bigger problem, so I accept it.

Rebels-- General Syndulla announcement and TWO Ghost cameos (one with the fleet, one in the first shot of the landing pad on Yavin)

Obi-Wan's mention-- like that it was there, but Bail didn't need to recycle the exact lines Leia uses in her message

Red and Gold Leaders-- No idea why, but I freaking loved recycling these guys to fit in.

 

Did not like:

R2 and 3P0-- I KNOW they have to be every SW movie... but it felt really forced. Like I need to hear 3P0 talking. Would have made more sense to just see them on the Tantive bridge with Leia in the background.

Evazan and Ponda-- eh. It was funny, but pointless.

A lack of Wedge and/or Biggs.

 

Glad they did NOT do even though they could have:

The Emperor-- feels right to leave him mysterious and detached so as not to ruin the build up to him in the OT

Han/Chewie/The Falcon-- would have been way too easy and felt like one too many things

Some sort of LET'S NAME A SQUADRON AFTER THEM moment. It's not hard to figure out.

Boba Fett-- I was waiting for it, I full expected it... thankfully, it didn't come.

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Dude, enough. That's a ****ty thing to say about somebody who has worked her ass off for decades. She's produced every classic Speilberg ever made. We get it, you're mad about the EU. Is there a way f

Were they shoving Han and Leia down our throat? Cause they kissed.   This is the root problem with diversity arguments. The only agenda is equal response. If a straight couple and a gay couple in a mo

Forgot to add-- funniest moment for me...   When "Red 5" was losing his cool, my kid leaned over and whispered "I thought Luke was Red 5."   Then the guy crashed.   "Oh-- I get it now."

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Very very good. I almost started to tear up around the midway point of the final battle. It felt like how I imagined reading Stackpole's books, mixed with Dark Forces. A loooot better than Force Awakens. The stakes were clear and I cared about most of the characters. All in all it nicely expands on the universe of the original films. The main badguy was freaking fantastic, though his comeuppance was kind of weak. They could have built the tension better there I thought.
A little heavy on the easter eggs, I had no idea Tarkin was in this, lol. Peter Cushing back from the dead... whodda thunkd it. He was fine, although they honestly should have just gotten new actors. The areas around the human eye and mouth have too much complex movement that is almost always distracting when not done properly in CGI. Vader was awesome, seeing his palace, and that entire scene, made me giddy. Seeing him go ape**** at the end... A+ My inner nerd slooged his pants. Leia looked awful. C3PO and R2 should have been left out as well. The few things I didnt like mostly revolved around the need to tie things to the OT in a nice bow, it felt too reminiscient of the end of ROTS in that respect.
Yeah, been waiting a loooong time for a really satisfying Star Wars movie. We'll see how it ages, but initial reaction is that it's almost something that deserves to sit on the same shelf as the original films.

And I gotta say, that whole refinery planet attack scene (in the rain) was just about the coolest thing ever. It felt like they lifted that straight out of Jedi Outcast or something. S'good.

The music was much better this time around, sounded classic Williams-y building on familiar themes without lazily wallowing in nostalgia... much like the film itself. Oooone problem: did anyone else start singing "maaakiing Chrissstmaaas la la la" at one point? Yeeah. They should have troll'd the audience and played 'My Heart Will Go On' over the end credits.

This just occured to me, and it's a strange, minor nitpick, but since they CG'd in other original X-Wing pilots it would have been nice to see Wedge, or even had someone new play him as a more prominent character. Oh well.

Something I REALLY wanted in TFA, that they did here, was building on Jedi lore. Seeing the ancient planet, temple, Kaiber crystal references. Nice touch. Made me tickle-y. Death Star made from the same crap as lightsabers? Cool. There were just a lot of times I caught myself saying "cooollll" watching this movie.
Also, re: the death star, I love how they took the inside joke of "giant open, vulnerable, weak spot on super weapon" and turned it into a main plot point. Clever, clever.

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It's been confirmed it's Mustafar by that Pablo guy, but I don't get why there was no title card. That was odd. . .and really inconsistent with the style they were going for.

They didn't give it a title card cause it would confirm the PT happen. Lucasfilm policy is to neither confirm nor deny the PT. ;P

I've actually been impressed they've been able to respect the continuity and events of the prequels without referencing it too much. Bringing Jimmy Smits back was a nice touch. The quick flashback to Courscant as well, when Jyn was a kid.

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And I'll incur the wrath of Walt... and no one else has brought this up yet-- but I thought the only thing that was truly bad about this movie was the music. It was terrible and on the nose. I don't know if this is because it was recycle Williams on top of one composer that got fired on top of a third that stepped in-- but I found it to be uninspiring and forced at every turn. Nothing iconic about it.

 

Agreed - the few times it was starting to get interesting was when it was doing it's own thing and not imitating and rehashing Williams all the time. Its actually made me appreciate TFA's soundtrack a lot more.

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It's not implausible that Red 2 and 3 we're out there. There were a lot of X-Wings. I loved the Y-Wing strike on the Star Destroyer. So cool.

 

Even though the Rebels struck a blow they took heavy losses as well.

 

Also, I actually liked that there was a bit of mud on the collar of the Rebellion. It felt like they were becoming a political faction and Rogue One's mission was the turning point for them. I think that Diego Luna's character (What a performance by the way!) was the story of the rebellion. He needed to change the way the Rebellion needed to change. It was no longer about cloak and dagger operations and politics. It was time for people to step up and take action.

 

I found the film most complimentary of the OT because of this.

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A lack of Wedge and/or Biggs.

 

The deleted Biggs subplot in A New Hope is still a part of canon right? That would mean that Biggs hasn't joined the Rebellion yet. He's either on Tatooine or just about to arrive on Tatooine as the climax is happening for that deleted scene with Luke and Biggs at Toche Station.

 

Did miss Wedge though. You're right that it was cool to see Gold Leader and Red Leader. I'm just waiting for the complaints that Porkins didn't get a mention to roll on in!

 

 

 

My biggest, (and frankly the only real) complaint about the movie is that it's tone is all over the place. Cassian's arc, as you point out, paints him as less than a nobel hero. While I appreciated it, and thought it was great for the character, it really threw off the tone of the movie. These shades of gray are new to Star Wars, which is generally painted in very simplistic terms.

 

Well, it did satisfy my worry that the movie was going to become to "rah rah". Matter of fact, the Rebellion takes some hits to their reputation with the way they ordered Cassian to assassinate Galen and their whole giving up bit (even after Jyn's platitudes!), though the last went too far and tipped into the complaints department.

 

 

 

Twileks come in lots of colors, why not Mon Cals? These ones also seemed to be a lot more blubbery too...

 

Didn't mean the color swap. That didn't really even trip me up. More the "blubbery" as you put it.

 

I kinda wish they'd used a bit more of a distinct voice for Raddus. I thought he was supposed to be Ackbar at first.

 

 

 

I loved the Y-Wing strike on the Star Destroyer. So cool.

 

I like the idea too, but it raises the question of why everyone just doesn't run a bunch of Y-Wings with ion torpedoes at capital ships in the first place? Wish they'd had them do something that made it feel like there was a reason it worked so well this time, like an unexpected chain reaction from just one of the torpedoes or something.

 

 

 

Forgot to add-- funniest moment for me...

 

When "Red 5" was losing his cool, my kid leaned over and whispered "I thought Luke was Red 5."

 

Then the guy crashed.

 

"Oh-- I get it now."

 

Heh.

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You need so much artistic license when you scale battles up (as in "where did that massive swarm of TIEs from the shield gate go?"), and it was obvious that they wanted to do some bombers v capital ships things that they were unable to do in ROTJ (although you do see the results of the planned B-Wing run on a ISD in a background shot).

 

(the battle of Scarif and the build up to it has lots of similarities with the battle of Endor and I wouldn't be surprised if many people involved in its production were realising dreams of a Battle of Endor without Ewoks and with more competent Imperial forces, but I doubt that you'll get much whinging about that from the "TFA was just a remake of ANH, lol" crowd)

 

Most people know about the rock <> paper <> scissors aspects of this (capital ships are extremely vulnerable to torpedoes / missiles, but point defenses on capital ships have limited effectiveness against swarm attacks from fighters and bombers = having a screen of fighters to intercept them), but sometimes you have to throw realism out of the window and just make it look as plausible as you can (using misdirection and other tricks) because you just want something cool / the good guys to win.

 

Trying to explain it away using other means (like the Rebel pilots in ANH not getting annihilated in seconds by hundreds of TIEs because of Imperial arrogance / oversight or having most of their TIE pilots on shore leave or something) just compounds the problem.

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Short version of thoughts:

 

Agree with Durty D on "patchy"; it had that first draft of something quality for me.

 

Like Lucas1138, I really wanted to love it and was really generous with it (just working through the pain of some painfully clunky scenes), but left the theater feeling a bit underwhelmed (but still really impressed with the spectacle of it),

 

Agree with Driver about the inconsistent tone; I liked the shades of gray and wanted that to be the dominant tone, so I didn't like feeling as if I was watching ROTJ again (a movie I've defended a lot because of nostalgia / memories of seeing it in a theater, but I now I see the problems) when not-admiral Ackbar turned up and started barking orders.

 

I wanted to feel more / get that emotional kick and be moved (and I know that's a tall order too), but I wasn't.

 

I was getting something resembling big feels during the first two parts of it (Ioved everything on Edau), but I thought the final act was over complicated (things like that subplot Poe mentioned) and a lot of the characters (including Krennic) didn't really get the epic final moments that I wanted for them.

 

I want to see it again (maybe next Tuesday), but I'm not desperate to see it again as I was with TFA.

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When this was first introduced I was really annoyed with the prospect of "shoehorning" Vader into it.

 

Then I saw the way Vader has been portrayed in Rebels and that comic. I need that Vader on the big screen.

*cackles maniacally*
This is singlehandedly going to make me go full-positive on this movie. Every time I think about that ending I get chills. I already can't wait to watch the first cut somebody makes of the last 5 minutes of Rogue One and the opening of ANH.

 

When this was first introduced I was really annoyed with the prospect of "shoehorning" Vader into it.

 

Then I saw the way Vader has been portrayed in Rebels and that comic. I need that Vader on the big screen.

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That's a good point. Krennic deserved to go out via Vader or Tarkin. It was kind of an ignominious end.

I actually loved that he died via the Death Star. It was very fitting (especially after reading Catalyst).

 

 

When this was first introduced I was really annoyed with the prospect of "shoehorning" Vader into it.

 

Then I saw the way Vader has been portrayed in Rebels and that comic. I need that Vader on the big screen.

*cackles maniacally*
This is singlehandedly going to make me go full-positive on this movie. Every time I think about that ending I get chills. I already can't wait to watch the first cut somebody makes of the last 5 minutes of Rogue One and the opening of ANH.

 

When this was first introduced I was really annoyed with the prospect of "shoehorning" Vader into it.

 

Then I saw the way Vader has been portrayed in Rebels and that comic. I need that Vader on the big screen.

 

Yeah, I've been listening to the "Hope" track from the score all morning and getting hyped to see it again.

 

Seeing Vader tear up those troops like that really hammers home how easy he goes on Luke in ESB.

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I've no clue why he shot up Saw Gerrera's guy though. I must have missed something there. Any help guys?

Someone else already mentioned it I believe. But the guy was about to throw a grenade at the tank, which would in effect kill Jyn. Cassian shot him to save her.

 

I agree about the music. As much as I thought TFA's score was underwhelming, it still feels like John Williams. This one felt like someone on YouTube adding their own music to a Star Wars movie.

 

As for the Mon Calamari, I love that they make beings from the same species look different. If humans on earth can have such a variety of different looks, why would we expect other species across a galaxy to look exactly the same?

 

I expect that over time the CGI of Tarkin and Leia will start to look dated and bad. But they worked for this movie. In fact, what jarred me more out of the movie for a bit was not either of them, but the first appearance of Vader. When he walked up to Krennic at the castle, you can just tell that's not Dave Prowse. Of course I know he can't do it anymore. But it astonishes me just how much of an impact he (as well as Peter Mayhew as Chewie) had on the character so much so that it stands out easily now when someone else is in the suit.

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(the battle of Scarif and the build up to it has lots of similarities with the battle of Endor and I wouldn't be surprised if many people involved in its production were realising dreams of a Battle of Endor without Ewoks and with more competent Imperial forces, but I doubt that you'll get much whinging about that from the "TFA was just a remake of ANH, lol" crowd)

 

 

There's a big difference between lifting the finale and lazily reassembling the OT.

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I swear the suits are different too (maybe not I haven't actually compared). Something just looks off. Maybe it's as simple as portrayal like you said.

 

I feel like the head and neck are... compact(?) in recent iterations.

Like I said. I found Vader's suit to be distracting. In ANH the suit was not as shiny as ESB and ROTJ. The neck of the helmet was under the cape, the shoulder armor was on top of the inner robes but under the cape. The eye lenses were slightly tinted red, and there were all sorts of other small things they fixed later.

 

R1 was trying to recreated the ANH look, but kind of over did it all. Like they did too good of a job. ANH lit and shot Vader to hide the flaws where as they were front and center in R1.

 

Also, Just remembered that blaster fire WAS strong enough for walker armor. fuck this movie.

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See, I knew there was something. Thanks for the specifics.

 

Does anybody agree about my (perhaps overly) negative James Earl Jones reaction?

 

How about the movie being too dark to see in the first 30 minutes, that a problem with my projector?

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Maybe it was your theater. I didn't notice any problems with it being too dark.

 

By the way, how long before this starts becoming a trend? It's already done for commercials (Marylin Monroe for Snickers.) So will we eventually see dead actors brought back to life to play major roles in future films?

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There's something about the way JEJ and Jabba's voices were processed in the OT... maybe some old lost analog device, in that they have never sounded right to me outside of the OT.

 

But at least it's JEJ and not the ALERT MY STAR DESTROYER TO PREPARE FOR MY ARRIVAL guy, or whomever does the fan film quality voice in Battlefront

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Ah, but X-Wing laser cannons might pack more of a punch than Snowspeeder cannons (and those ground-based weapons)... and the gunner in that U-Wing really had to pound the leg of that walker to bring it down... and maybe they upgraded the walkers after this battle... but how would they have known about any weak spots / was any video / telemetry from the battle received by the Imperial ships in orbit before the battlefield was obliterated by the shock wave / fireball from the superlaser shot? And so on...

 

(I didn't think the Vader & Krennic scene worked that well for several reasons either, but I went with it)

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