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Well, so far, Trump has tapped Steve Bannon, who is alt right, and has been called racist, white-nationalist, and anti-Jewish as his chief strategist. One could almost overlook that as ant-Trump propaganda, except for the fact Trump has now tapped Jeff Sessions, also a known racist (he once said the only reason he was against the KKK is that they smoke marijuana, but they are otherwise okay), anti-immigration supporter, and climate change denier.

The thing to do then would be to call them racist and see how they respond. Unlike the neo-cons or the religious right, the alt-right doesn't recoil from accusations of racism or misogyny.

 

That's their strength. They watched the conservatives fail, and they learned from those failures. They changed and adapted while the progressives grew complacent and ideologically excessive. The alt-right embrace everything the progressives demonize: masculine virulence and pride in one's culture and heritage for people of European descent. When accused of racism and privilege, the alt-right goes on the offensive, not the defensive. And they're now in the White House because of it.

 

The left is going to have to do it's own version of the same thing if they are to recover and become something that can challenge the alt-right, which also has a LOT of exploitable weaknesses.

 

It starts by learning to "walk into the fire" so to speak. Stop fearing the labels that the conservatives use to tar the left and frame the debate. Bernie Sanders inadvertently began the process when he used a certain word, historically very dirty in US politics - to describe his political views and was wildly popular in spite of, or perhaps because of it.

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I think that's a little extreme and harsh to say.   Let's look back and see who is making fun of the crying--   Kurgan-- white guy Marc-- white guy Carrie-- a complex AI in female human form Justus- w

Originally posted by Justus:       This is exactly what happened. They watched the gays pull Gotchas on religious business owners, trying to run them out of business, rather than just changing the

A very well written post.   I lean more left on social issues than right, but I can't say I disagree with you. There really was not a good choice this election cycle. Even during the primaries.

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One of my favorite things to do recently is to watch SJW election meltdowns on youtube. I knew people were going to have a hard time with Trump in office but dammmn. A lot of them are saying they're gonna kill themselves, most go on about Trump supporters being idiots/racists/whatever (thanks!), some are even breaking they're TVs, and yeah, there's a ton of tears.

 

Give em a try, Tami. Might make you feel better!

I must admit, I have enjopyed theswe as well

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monkeygirl has been a total bitch who has either outright stated or insinuated that every Trump supporter is a racist. She's not interested in doing anything other than shaming everyone who disagrees with her because she lives in a bubble and is full of hate. So, yeah, I'm going to call her on being a bitch, and those people cost Hillary the election.

 

If you're okay with her being a bitch, that's fine, but don't say that I can't call her on it because I'm a white male.

 

If that's the case, then as a rich white male, you should literally not be able to speak period.

Not a TOTAOL bitch just, like 95%. AND I"VE SAID LIKE A BILLION TIMES I KNOW I'm acting like a baby! GAWQDDD

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monkeygirl has been a total bitch who has either outright stated or insinuated that every Trump supporter is a racist. She's not interested in doing anything other than shaming everyone who disagrees with her because she lives in a bubble and is full of hate. So, yeah, I'm going to call her on being a bitch, and those people cost Hillary the election.

 

If you're okay with her being a bitch, that's fine, but don't say that I can't call her on it because I'm a white male.

 

If that's the case, then as a rich white male, you should literally not be able to speak period.

Don't get mad. I wasn't saying that at all. You can 100% say what you think, I ain't no censor. I was just pointing out why people who aren't white males see statements like that as one of privilege. Not saying it;s right or, wrong, just why.

 

If the people crying were actually doing something about it instead of just getting together to cry, or were protesting with actual goals other than just to make noise, I would be there with them. I never even considered voting Trump, and if he does screw up, I'll be among the first screaming for impeachment. But the overly emotional activities do nothing but hurt the cause. And, again, the people who keep painting 47% of the US as racist/sexist/horrible people for voting Trump are just plain stupid. And I'm not backing down from that at all, even if Cerina decides to ban me.

 

But you don't know that the people who are crying are also doing. Most of those I'm talking to with the worst reactions have been signing up for MORE

civic duties and looking to get on committees and calling their representatives. Most of 'my people' are DOING things along with crying. I have not

cried, physically, myself, but I am genuinely afraid for my gay and trans friends. My BFF has already been harassed a couple times since the election

in the name of Trump. I know he didn't directly issue it, but the idiots used his name. In both cases, it was just verbal, but she did nothing

to invite it. My trans Aunt just lost her job. My loved ones are already being adversely touched and it worries me. I'm getting over being OVERLY emotional

about it but I'm not going to stop calling the administration out. About half his appointments so far have been heinous and the absolute

bull**** about Hamilton and Stubby Fingers' newest twitter war is just solidifying my beliefs that President trump is going to be identical

to Candidate Trump.

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I know the people who I know that are the loudest, and I live in a huge college city, so I know a lot of whiners who are doing absolutely nothing other than crying and/or demanding that Hillary be elected. Which, considering the exact same people were complaining to me about Trump not promising to accept the results of the election is somewhere between hilarious and depressing.

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But you don't know that the people who are crying are also doing. Most of those I'm talking to with the worst reactions have been signing up for MORE

civic duties and looking to get on committees and calling their representatives. Most of 'my people' are DOING things along with crying. I have not

cried, physically, myself, but I am genuinely afraid for my gay and trans friends. My BFF has already been harassed a couple times since the election

in the name of Trump. I know he didn't directly issue it, but the idiots used his name. In both cases, it was just verbal, but she did nothing

to invite it. My trans Aunt just lost her job. My loved ones are already being adversely touched and it worries me. I'm getting over being OVERLY emotional

about it but I'm not going to stop calling the administration out. About half his appointments so far have been heinous and the absolute

bull**** about Hamilton and Stubby Fingers' newest twitter war is just solidifying my beliefs that President trump is going to be identical

to Candidate Trump.

Going forward, Monkeygirl, I think there's two paths the US left can go by.

 

The first is to see working class white males as racial and sexual oppressors and continue to support a DLC that masks its neo-con reality - see Clinton's support for the war in Iraq, the Patriot Act, the TPP, the border fence act, on and on and on - behind a thin veneer of "progressive" identity politics, and ideological abominations such as privilege theory and "prejudice plus power." You won't have health care or a living wage, but at least you'll get to feel morally superior to those basement dwelling Bernie Bro's who simply won't check their privilege and insist on mansplaining, blind to their <gasp> whiteness! Okay, this is widely acknowledged as what got Trump in the White House, but don't let that stop you. If you always do what you always did, you'll always get what you always got.

 

The second is to see working class white males as class allies - they want the same things you do on issues of substance - and work together to support candidates like Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren and start moving towards that certain word that's been too long vilified in American politics now.

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I have not

cried, physically, myself, but I am genuinely afraid for my gay and trans friends.

I still don't get this. Trump, throughout the campaign, has been remarkably consistent that he doesn't really give a sh-t about this issue. He came out pretty unambiguously in favor of trans rights, when no other GOP candidate would. Just last week in the 60 minutes interview, he explicitly said he's not against gay marriage and not going to try and overturn it or anything. Trump is arguably the most liberal president on gay/trans rights to ever run in US history, so, really what is this about?

 

I mean, now if you were worried about say, an illegal immigrant friend of yours, I would get it. I still think that would be a little dramatic, but at least it would be connected to an actual policy position Trump has. But gay issues? Really?

 

Obama says he's against gay marriage in '08, but he's given the benefit of the doubt. Why? Oh, because he was just saying what he "had to." So, he gets a pass... just because he's a Democrat? Why doesn't Trump get any benefit of the doubt, when he, on the record, is more liberal than Obama was when he was elected? And when we're talking about a lifelong Manhattan resident, who has been a Democrat for most of his life, who has probably stepped foot in a church maybe 3 times in his entire life, that for goodness sake, celebrated Elton John's wedding. Not exactly a bumf-ck redneck from Alabama or something.

 

Why don't we just admit what's really going on here. No matter what Trump's actual position is on this, you were always going to claim he's "anti gay" just because you don't like that a Republican won. The only reason I suspect you're "afraid," is just because you''re pissed your team lost, and the other team won, and this is really just an elaborate self-coping mechanism. Instead of just dealing with it normally, it comes off as being overly dramatic and emotional and, in a display of astonishing narcissism, trying to make this about you and how you feel, and proclaiming how terrified you are as a way of just expressing the fact that you don't like that team Blue lost.

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One of my favorite things to do recently is to watch SJW election meltdowns on youtube. I knew people were going to have a hard time with Trump in office but dammmn. A lot of them are saying they're gonna kill themselves, most go on about Trump supporters being idiots/racists/whatever (thanks!), some are even breaking they're TVs, and yeah, there's a ton of tears. Give em a try, Tami. Might make you feel better!

I must admit, I have enjopyed theswe as well

Cool. Can you post a vid of you crying? I know it's been a week and a half but I'm sure you can still muster up some tears.

 

Hell kill a couple of cats if you have to. I'm hungry.

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Trump is a giant asshole. I voted for him. If you want to vote for someone because they are likeable you should have voted Bernie Sanders as a write-in...but that would mean you did voting wrong.

 

Pick an issue or issues that affect you, and find

a candidate you can get behind based on that.

 

If you thought having open borders and free college education for everybody irrespective of the job market is good for you, you vote Hilary. I paid big bucks and worked hard for my degree, and good jobs in general are hard to come by. Why would I vote for her? It's the opposite of helping myself. I didn't have nearly enough white guilt to have done that.

 

Trump wants to build a wall. In other words enforce the laws that are already in place, which we should have been doing the whole time. The way it should be. Immigration as a function of te job market. I the country needs 50k additional college educated workers, and 300k additional uneducated workers, then that's how many you let in. You don't let in whatever and educate them all (and everybody else) on the status quo's dime. If you think immigration reform helps you...and how the hell wouldn't it...you vote for Trump. If you think his foreign policy sucks and is more important, you don't. If you don't care about any of this, base your vote on whatever does. To vote for him because you like him is the worst reason in the world to do so...plus I don't understand What's to like.

 

I wish people who vote for or against anybody because of some arbitrary reason like "they just like them" or "they are just too icky" should stay home on Election Day. If they did I wonder how this election would have turned out.

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Omg! Sheriff Joe is top of the list for homeland security. Wtf?

I almost am mad now he didn't win reelection. :p Bastard's gonna be everyone's probable not just ours. Hopefully that ***hole doesn't get though, he is currently on trial here so he may not be in office that long if he gets convicted.

 

I guess this is a good time to say I voted for Stein. I really went back and forth cause I detested the idea of trump cause he's just terrible in every way but I couldn't put my name behind Hilary. Some of her policies changed thanks to Bernie but she never talked about them after the race really heated up between she and Trump so it really made me think she wasn't that serious about it. Like making tuition free for families making under $150k at public institutions and withdrawing support for the TPP (it's not just about the jobs, it's the terrible language about how companies can sue over things like collecting rain water because it cuts into someone's profits. Or countries for passing regulatory measures against like cigarette companies for putting warning labels on things, an oil company already did just this using NAFTA the case is ongoing). She also seems to be a pretty big supporter of fracking which being such a well known environmentalist you'd think she'd do some research there or have someone fill her in on why that's a terrible idea. She even championed the practice as secretary of state. I understand, a lot of the resources obtained that way are cleaner than oil but it causes earthquakes and ground water contamination in a lot of cases. Finally, and probably the biggest issue for me, is she is still pushing war policies and has always seemed to vote for bigger defense. Like her idea for the no fly zone in Syria just is going to antagonize the Russians, they've said as much but she refused to back down from it.

 

So I guess in short she wasn't left enough for my taste, I'd be a proud Democrat if they were still the party of FDR but they clearly are not. Did I want her to lose? Not really but in the end I didn't vote for her so I have to swallow that pill whatever Trump throws at us. In the meantime I'm hoping the DNC takes this time to reflect on what their actual message to the people is before the next election. Are they still the champions of the common American or have they sold out far enough that they can't see past blaming everyone else for their mistakes? So far I've only seen the latter but hopefully once the rage dies down they'll have some time to think over things. Right now my eyes are on Sanders and Warren making the most waves the next four years while the rest of the establishment continues to sit on their hands while the republicans do whatever the **** they want.

 

Edit: forgot a word

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Guest El Chalupacabra

 

Omg! Sheriff Joe is top of the list for homeland security. Wtf?

I almost am mad now he didn't win reelection. :p Bastard's gonna be everyone's probable not just ours. Hopefully that ***hole doesn't get though, he is currently on trial here so he may not be in office that long if he gets convicted.

 

 

 

Why you gotta be so hateful to wish that on me??

 

Seriously though, that hasn't been repeated for a couple weeks now. Arpaio is 84 and Arpaio's wife has cancer. I don't think he will be moving from his cushy Fountain Hills home to Washington DC to take any job, assuming one is even going to be offered, which I doubt.

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Hahaha well it's sorta on me too, though I am not in his county most of my siblings are and I have to hear about him on the local news all the time. You're right though, I doubt he'd actually make the cut and probably wouldn't be able to accept for family reasons if he did. He's popular with people who are in favor of the wall I'm sure so it's really no surprise his name was floated despite his current legal trouble.

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I know that not all Trump supporters are racist, homophobic, sexist bigots. But some of them are, and if there's even the slightest chance that they feel vindicated or mobilized or encouraged and free to exact that racism/homophobia/sexism on others then there's cause to be fearful.

 

 

But it does not help when the left's more outspoken media mouthpieces--such as Janeane Garofalo--who is not in comedy-schtick mode when she claims all Trump supporters are racist, or when her former employer (Sam Seder) pushes the idea that the Trump movement was largely based on race. They are far from alone in that view.

 

Regarding the idea that Trump's victory means supporters feel encouraged to commit acts of violence against the race/gender of choice, at the moment, i'm calling that (in large part) paranoia divorced from the way hate crime spikes work. For example, in the 1990s--the Glorious Bill Clinton Years, hate crimes were exploding under the climate of liberal Bill, with one year (1996) particularly violent--8,759 reported hate crimes. Just one year earlier, the greatest act of domestic anti-government / hate hit the U.S. in the form of McVeigh's terrorist attack on the Murrah Federal Building, As a matter of record, McVeigh was inspired by the white supremacist book, The Turner Diaries, and had ties to those kind of organizations.

 

The overall point being that up to this time, the United States has faced far worse than anything currently inspired by Trump's victory....but its too much to ask some to stop seeing themselves as the most beleaguered group in history, and realize that their self-made boogeyman is not the rallying cry for the second civil war in America.

 

Cry sessions...really?

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The only way that even potentially works is if they can get every Democrat to promise to vote for Kasich, and then hope for enough Republicans to switch.

 

Otherwise, the real goal is to get it to the House, where they hope to get something different.

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The only way that even potentially works is if they can get every Democrat to promise to vote for Kasich, and then hope for enough Republicans to switch.

 

Yeah, that's actually the "plan" as it is. Not that it's anything more than wishing and hoping, but it's nice to wish and hope.

 

 

 

Plus, is the best candidate really the guy who is only capable of winning one state?

 

Kasich ran as a squish. Democrats like squishes. They claim that only a squish could defeat them because anyone who is actually conservative is just too extreme for the country. Plus they get what they want either way.

 

No, he's not the best candidate. Matter of fact he's an idiot egomaniac that stayed in the race just long enough to be a spoiler to deny Cruz a chance to consolidate against Trump and then dropped out within hours after Cruz. But he's better than either Trump or Clinton, which I'll personally take.

 

 

 

Otherwise, the real goal is to get it to the House, where they hope to get something different.

 

The House has to vote for the Top 3. So it would be the same 3 choices either way.

 

 

 

OMG!

 

https://docs.google....sle=true#gid=19

 

Hillary received more votes than her husband did!

 

That link says absolutely nothing about Bill Clinton's runs.

 

Not sure why it's surprising. Thanks to Perot and population growth, every single Republican and Democrat since 1996 got more votes than Bill Clinton, and that race can barely be classified as competitive. Reagan and Bush got more votes than Clinton in '84 and '88. Heck, he only got 250,000 more votes than Nixon did in '72.

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But that's kind of neat right? More people voted this time for this particular election than say the last 4 presidential elections. The link was about current counts for this election which is kind of nice to comb through. I guess making people do actual work with google to find out the votes of previous elections is my teacher stuff coming up. I'm not doing the work for you. You have to try and find it on your own. Learning stuff is cool. :cool:

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