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Snoke is NOT Darth Plagueis


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Anyone have TFA novelization? Another site posted a supposed excerpt from said novel of lines between Snoke and Ren that didn't make it into the film and I wanted to verify it:

 

"Kylo Ren, I watched the Galactic Empire rise, and then fall. The gullible prattle on about the triumph of truth and justice, of individualism and free will. As if such things were solid and real instead of simple subjective judgments. The historians have it all wrong. It was neither poor strategy nor arrogance that brought down the Empire. You know too well what did."

 

Ren nodded once. "Sentiment."

 

"Yes. Such a simple thing. Such a foolish error of judgment. A momentary lapse in an otherwise exemplary life. Had Lord Vader not succumbed to emotion at the crucial moment-had the father killed the son-the Empire would have prevailed. And there would be no threat of Skywalker's return today."

How does this make him Darth Plagueis? It just makes him someone who was alive during the rise and fall of the Empire.

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Anyone have TFA novelization? Another site posted a supposed excerpt from said novel of lines between Snoke and Ren that didn't make it into the film and I wanted to verify it:

 

"Kylo Ren, I watched the Galactic Empire rise, and then fall. The gullible prattle on about the triumph of truth and justice, of individualism and free will. As if such things were solid and real instead of simple subjective judgments. The historians have it all wrong. It was neither poor strategy nor arrogance that brought down the Empire. You know too well what did."

 

Ren nodded once. "Sentiment."

 

"Yes. Such a simple thing. Such a foolish error of judgment. A momentary lapse in an otherwise exemplary life. Had Lord Vader not succumbed to emotion at the crucial moment-had the father killed the son-the Empire would have prevailed. And there would be no threat of Skywalker's return today."

How does this make him Darth Plagueis? It just makes him someone who was alive during the rise and fall of the Empire.
I wasn't saying this was confirmation that Snoke = Plagueis. Just pointing out the confirmation (if we took the novelization as canon) that Snoke has been around a long time. Speaking of which...

Interesting...

 

But the ANH novelization told us Owen was Obi-WN's brother. Just saying.

That's true. It's hard to take anything in the film novelizations at face value seeing as how some major plot points in previous novels were contradicted in the films. But as you well know Lucas was lacking when it came to continuity. You'd hope that with the big deal Disney made to get rid of the EU and making a concrete determination on what is canon and what is not; even putting together a team charged with keeping continuity intact, that these kinds of slips between film and novel wouldn't happen anymore.
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I don't know-- but just because we don't know that doesn't mean it's Plagueis. That's a frequent fanboy mistake-- there's an EU theory that fits, so that must be it if there isn't an alternative.

 

JJ has already said he left a lot of mystery open for Episode 8 to play with.

 

All evidence points to the Ren being another sect of Force users-- like the Jedi, Sith or Nightsisters and Snoke being on of them that remained in the shadows during the clone wars waiting for the Sith and Jedi to kill each other off.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

We can only guess who and what Snoke is, but I think we can pretty much safely eliminate Plagueis.

 

Going by what's stated on screen, Plagueis is stated to be dead by Palpatine. The whole point of bringing Plagueis up in the first place was to demonstrate the irony that even someone who knows how to keep others from dying, could not prevent his own death. The implied message is Plagueis was Palpatine's former master Palpatine is gloating a bit, on the eve of him gaining a new apprentice and total galactic control. It simply makes no sense for Plagueis to be alive, since Palpatine is established as the Sith Master, and he his grooming Anakin to be his new apprentice. It makes even less sense that Snoke is secretly Plagueis. Beyond that, we know nothing about Plagueis on screen. In EU, it is established that Plagueis is a Muun who is clearly dead, which Snoke does not appear to be in TFA.

 

Also, it doesn't make sense for Snoke to be a Sith, since they were supposedly destroyed by Luke.

 

I think Snoke is likely one of the following:

1. A previously not detailed member of another dark side force user sect, not affiliated with the Sith or Jedi

2. Snoke is a former member of the Emperor's inner circle (IE similar to the unnamed imperial advisers in ROTJ...now named in EU)

3. Snoke is a former imperial inquisitor.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

I hope Kylo kills him in short order

Me too. Of course we know that at least with the Sith, and we can also assume with any dark side master/apprentice relationship, once the apprentice surpasses the master, the apprentice kills the master. But we have never seen that in any of the 7 Star Wars movies, yet.

 

I would like to see Snoke get his comeuppance from the monster he creates in Kylo Ren. That way we both see how powerful and how irredeemable Kylo Ren has become. True evil doesn't like to share power. Also, like I said in another thread, it further shows Kylo Ren's journey is both different from Vader's and also an inversion of Luke's.

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