Odine Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Hypothetical question: Is there an issue, be it political or social, or economic (or economic and social issues that are politicised) that polarises Americans to such an extent it could potentially lead to an internal conflict involving regional governments versus federal vs sectarian groups or what have you? I have heard that there are people who beleive Texas should suceed the United States and become it's own nation. Having briefly seen two US states (as a visitor) and noticed the differing cultures in those two (which are largely similar) I can only gather other states must be vastly different. In that they probably are as different from each other as one small European nation is to the next. Are there issues facing the United States that exasperate these differences and polarise state against state? And does the federal government have tenuous control over the country as a whole? I suppose these questions are rather different than the thread title suggests but I guess they are all related. If a state was to secede I would assume that some violence/skirmishes would occur. OR Is this so far fetched that it is unimaginable even under hypothetical variables? Regardless of social/political issues are United States citizens resolute enough in their identity as US citizens that succeeding from the federal government/country never gonna happen? Feel free to answer all or none of those.. It is something I have been thinking about for a while, particularly after having visited the United States twice as an outsider and have been blown away by it's size, variety/variation. It amazes me that a country so large can contain itself and function as a nation. And yet it does, and it's both awesome and terrifying at the same time. No disrespect. Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest El Chalupacabra Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Is this so far fetched that it is unimaginable even under hypothetical variables? Regardless of social/political issues are United States citizens resolute enough in their identity as US citizens that succeeding from the federal government/country never gonna happen?This is far more likely. Texas, or any other state seceding is far less likely than Scotland seceding from the UK, which itself failed recently. But the point is, any state even having a ballot for such a thing is a remote possibility to begin with. All the states are very much economically intertwined, and Federal government is far too powerful to let such a thing happen, in the first place. When you hear Texans, Alaskans, Pacific North-westerners, etc talking secession, they are generally either crazies, or people who are saying such a thing just to make a political statement, and rile people up for whatever personal gain. Now, one could argue that there are multiple social and cultural civil wars going on today (IE black VS white/dominant culture riots against police brutality, conservative VS progressive, urban secular values VS rural traditional values, etc), and that politics in the last 25 years has become the most polarizing since at least 1968, but politics has always been nasty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odine Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 That was a pretty damn solid answer.. thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pong Messiah Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 What Chalupa said, basically. I'd honestly like to see the U.S. (peacefully) dissolve into several different countries, or at the very least, see the states become far more autonomous than they are. But as things stand right now, it's totally unrealistic; the federal government is so powerful and states are so joined at the hip to it, things would have to be really bad for a secession to be taken seriously, and the state would have to be ready to accept a rocky transition. Even when things are "bad" in the U.S. we got it pretty good in a lot of ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Driver Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Yeah, echoing above. I'd love to not be in the same country as the bible belt and parts of the south-- but it's not going to happen. Another key component is geography. Scotland was it's own thing before. The North and South in the American civil war found ideologies forming along geographic lines. That could never happen now. Our government is mostly decentralized, our military is made from people all over the country stationed in other parts of the country. This eliminates ideology being associated with place. Plus, most of the socio/economic issues that divide Americans seem to be split between cities and populated areas. Even in the liberal dreamland of the west coast-- step outside of Seattle, Portland, San Francisco, or Los Angeles into the less populated areas of the states and you might as well be in backwoods Arkansas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 People talk about Texas seceding only because we were our own country. But we only were for 10 years while we were trying to be a part of the union. The Republic of Texas was really a HUGE failure. Other than that, Texas is in the best position of any other state to secede, but it wouldn't be a good choice regardless. And it definitely wouldn't be an easy transition by any means. And what Driver said about urban and rural areas. Here in Houston we have a openly lesbian mayor, a thriving and vibrant gay community, and an anti-discrimination ordinance. Houston doesn't really reflect the same socially conservative ideals that you find in smaller communities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 99% agree. However, as long we have states that celebrate treason ("Confederate Heroes Day"?), there's hope that eventually those states that hate America will finally leave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pong Messiah Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 why does fozzie hate america Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RelentlessMalice Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Rather than the states, I would prefer the people who hate the U.S. to leave. If there is a better place then write these folks a check to where ever the hell they want to go and be done with it. It would be a great investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 99% agree. However, as long we have states that celebrate treason ("Confederate Heroes Day"?), there's hope that eventually those states that hate America will finally leave.*cough* Independence Day *cough* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Krawlie Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Yeah but we won that war. The south lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Treason is treason. And history is written by the winners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 99% agree. However, as long we have states that celebrate treason ("Confederate Heroes Day"?), there's hope that eventually those states that hate America will finally leave.*cough* Independence Day *cough* I'm not aware of any Americans who celebrate that day claiming they want to be UK citizens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest El Chalupacabra Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 People talk about Texas seceding only because we were our own country. But we only were for 10 years while we were trying to be a part of the union. The Republic of Texas was really a HUGE failure. Other than that, Texas is in the best position of any other state to secede, but it wouldn't be a good choice regardless. And it definitely wouldn't be an easy transition by any means. No people talk about Texas seceding because Texans are obnoxious about it. You can thank morons like Rick Perry for the deserved ridicule, BTW. California, Vermont, and Hawaii were all independent nations for a short time at one point, as well, but few people think of them seceding except a small crowd in California maybe, and none of those states approach the obnoxiousness of Texan secessionists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odine Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 Thanks everyone that's sated some curiosity for sure. Politics in Britain is fucked. It's difficult for anyone to find a party/polititian who really has their interests at heart, or at least "represents" their ideology even slightly. I can only imagine that in a country like the USA it must be even more difficult for some, being that the place is so much larger under the one government with a broader population. Although, I'd wager because of London the the voting population of Britain is perhaps more ethnically diverse per capita than the US. If that impacts political decision making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Exactly where do those planning on leaving the country think they're gonna go? Someplace that speaks English, I'll bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Naboo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 People talk about Texas seceding only because we were our own country. But we only were for 10 years while we were trying to be a part of the union. The Republic of Texas was really a HUGE failure. Other than that, Texas is in the best position of any other state to secede, but it wouldn't be a good choice regardless. And it definitely wouldn't be an easy transition by any means. No people talk about Texas seceding because Texans are obnoxious about it. I don't get this. I've lived here all my life and never once heard anyone say anything that would suggest they want Texas to secede. But I see it all the time from people in other states. Where are you hearing that Texans want to secede? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest El Chalupacabra Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 People talk about Texas seceding only because we were our own country. But we only were for 10 years while we were trying to be a part of the union. The Republic of Texas was really a HUGE failure. Other than that, Texas is in the best position of any other state to secede, but it wouldn't be a good choice regardless. And it definitely wouldn't be an easy transition by any means. No people talk about Texas seceding because Texans are obnoxious about it. I don't get this. I've lived here all my life and never once heard anyone say anything that would suggest they want Texas to secede. But I see it all the time from people in other states. Where are you hearing that Texans want to secede? All you have to do is google it, Cerina. I'm not saying all Texans say that they want to secede. Just the ones that do, are obnoxious about it. Which is why people outside of Texas make fun of the secessionists. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 People talk about Texas seceding only because we were our own country. But we only were for 10 years while we were trying to be a part of the union. The Republic of Texas was really a HUGE failure. Other than that, Texas is in the best position of any other state to secede, but it wouldn't be a good choice regardless. And it definitely wouldn't be an easy transition by any means. No people talk about Texas seceding because Texans are obnoxious about it. I don't get this. I've lived here all my life and never once heard anyone say anything that would suggest they want Texas to secede. But I see it all the time from people in other states. Where are you hearing that Texans want to secede? Rick Perry, and every third bumper sticker that I saw in Austin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cerina Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Again, lived in Austin for years...maybe saw one or two. But whatever, people believe what they want to believe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pong Messiah Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 I'm not aware of any Americans who celebrate that day claiming they want to be UK citizens.at the risk of affirming fozzies spurious claims that i live in an ultra liberal bubble ive known people who whine about independence day being a horrific celebration of stupidity/racism/oppression/imperialism who openly wish they could move to canada the uk or some utopian nordic country of course this is more of an every day thing not something that is said only once a year but still Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pong Messiah Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Again, lived in Austin for years...maybe saw one or two. But whatever, people believe what they want to believe. Pfft... terrible example. Austin is like that amazing brunch place everybody knows about that's smack in middle of the industrial district, right on the corner of SW 4th and Rapey Way. I hate Texas, but I'd love to live in Austin; even considered going to college there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Again, lived in Austin for years...maybe saw one or two. But whatever, people believe what they want to believe. Maybe it was just where we were, but I counted 12 in one day. Maybe things have changed with the influx of people into Austin, maybe hipsters put them on ironically, who knows. But they were there, I assure you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pong Messiah Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Yeah, Austin is nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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