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Police shot Ohio man ‘on sight’ as he leaned on toy gun in Walmart


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I avoided the other high-publicity police-shooting story because it became clear minutes in that breathless hype was going to overshadow any facts that came out (facts that would be discounted or disbelieved by people if it didn't validate their prejudice anyway).

*Claims to not buy into "breathless hype" when no facts are out*

 

*Posts news story with no confirmed facts and all quotes from the victim's attorney*

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Nothing ever good happens in a Walmart. Ever.

That's a good breakdown of strawman versus opinion. You should be ashamed for thinking it's good for anything else.   If the state takes a life without due process, it should be held to the highest

I'll second the "policing themselves" notion. There should be no such thing as "internal investigation" for any suspicious conduct. It should routinely be referred out to a third party investigative

Pong, of course I'm being deliberately facetious when it comes to self-defense issues. But the reality is, cops are a bunch of trigger-happy thugs whose modern mantra seems to be: Shoot first, ask questions later.

Please provide from where you got the statistic that a majority of police in the US "shoot first, ask questions later."

 

I'm really interested to know the number of incidents where shots were fired before questions were asked. Of course, you wouldn't be making up anything. After all, only Tea-Party type people do that, you know, people that think Obama was born in Kenya and believe Jesus talks to them. And clearly you're not that stupid.

 

You can go ahead and just post the link to the peer reviewed study you read right below this post and I'll peruse it at my leisure. Thanks!

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No police would see a white person and instantly not view them as a direct threat. But cops are afraid of black people, and will shoot them more readily than a white person. It's police profiling. And if you think it's not like that then you're naive.

 

Wahhh waaah wahhh *failed artist pretending to know what it's like to be a black person in the US* wahhhhhhh wah wah whine whine whine

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Sorry to disappoint you Carrie...But I AM that stupid! I believe that the majority of cops are thugs, and I subscribe to CopBlock and similar items in my newsfeed. And gasp...This might really break your stereotype!...But you KNOW I'm not an anti-Obama Tea Party type. I just hate men in blue uniforms.

 

And please remind me...Where did I post a statistic (as opposed to an opinion)? I don't recall typing anything about probability, standard deviation, variance, significance, etc. No r2 values, no correlation tests. At least in the posts I'm looking at, and they don't seem to have been edited.

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You disclaimed a prior comment by saying "oh hey, I was being facetious earlier," and then followed that up by saying "but the reality is..." Thus strongly implying that your follow up comment was not meant in jest, but was a serious point... a point, presumably, backed up by something- thus your use of the word "reality." Need I define what "reality" means?

 

I believe that the majority of cops are thugs, and I subscribe to CopBlock and similar items in my newsfeed. And gasp...This might really break your stereotype!...But you KNOW I'm not an anti-Obama Tea Party type.

I believe that Obama is a Muslim! And I subscribe to Stormfront in my newsfeed. And gasp... this might really break your stereotype! But you know I'm not a racist or something like that. I got facts on this. I swear. It's not my ignorant opinion completely rooted in bias or anything.... I mean, look at him! He's black!

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I avoided the other high-publicity police-shooting story because it became clear minutes in that breathless hype was going to overshadow any facts that came out (facts that would be discounted or disbelieved by people if it didn't validate their prejudice anyway).

*Claims to not buy into "breathless hype" when no facts are out*

 

*Posts news story with no confirmed facts and all quotes from the victim's attorney*

 

lol wut crawled up your butt and died this morning?

 

I don't see any protests, looting, race hustling, or 24/7 coverage from Fox and MSNBC casting a pall over this story. It's still more news item than political event. Furthermore, I have never claimed to be unbiased when it comes to police shootings. Never. If there is ever any question about a person they shoot being a threat, they are guilty until proven innocent in my eyes (and yes, my mind can be changed). Unless information is revealed that demonstrates the victim was a threat, I'm going with the attorney's version of events. Not sure why you'd expect anything else or what your problem is. :)

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Reality is relative. And my reality is generally that cops can't be trusted. You'd almost think I was black based only on my suspicion of police. And yes, I have encountered a few genuinely nice, courteous police officers. But they get overshadowed by all the psychos out there.

 

And I'd never take you to be a racist Carrie...But a classist? EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK!

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No police would see a white person and instantly not view them as a direct threat. But cops are afraid of black people, and will shoot them more readily than a white person. It's police profiling. And if you think it's not like that then you're naive.

Wahhh waaah wahhh *failed artist pretending to know what it's like to be a black person in the US* wahhhhhhh wah wah whine whine whine
Hahahaha

 

I wasn't whining you horrible cunt, just pointing out how it is for other people.

Edited by Odine
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No police would see a white person and instantly not view them as a direct threat. But cops are afraid of black people, and will shoot them more readily than a white person. It's police profiling. And if you think it's not like that then you're naive.

Wahhh waaah wahhh *failed artist pretending to know what it's like to be a black person in the US* wahhhhhhh wah wah whine whine whine
Hahahaha

 

I wasn't whining you horrible ****, just pointing out how it is for other people.

 

Pointing out how is it for people you have literally no experience with, whatsoever?

 

I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but do you actually have any real life experience with an economically disadvantaged black person in a confrontation with the police?

 

Or are you, as I suspect, just re-posting random bullsh-t you've heard on the internet?

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Reality is relative. And my reality is generally that cops can't be trusted. You'd almost think I was black based only on my suspicion of police. And yes, I have encountered a few genuinely nice, courteous police officers. But they get overshadowed by all the psychos out there.

 

And I'd never take you to be a racist Carrie...But a classist? EVERY DAY OF THE WEEK!

Stop trying to weasel your way out of this. Do you actually have any basis for what you believe, or is your opinion wholly formed by bias and lack of perspective?

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I avoided the other high-publicity police-shooting story because it became clear minutes in that breathless hype was going to overshadow any facts that came out (facts that would be discounted or disbelieved by people if it didn't validate their prejudice anyway).

*Claims to not buy into "breathless hype" when no facts are out*

 

*Posts news story with no confirmed facts and all quotes from the victim's attorney*

 

lol wut crawled up your butt and died this morning?

 

I don't see any protests, looting, race hustling, or 24/7 coverage from Fox and MSNBC casting a pall over this story. It's still more news item than political event. Furthermore, I have never claimed to be unbiased when it comes to police shootings. Never. If there is ever any question about a person they shoot being a threat, they are guilty until proven innocent in my eyes (and yes, my mind can be changed). Unless information is revealed that demonstrates the victim was a threat, I'm going with the attorney's version of events. Not sure why you'd expect anything else or what your problem is. :)

 

I remember a couple of years ago, her trying to argue that cases like this were 'isolated incidents'. And yet, not a week goes by that we don't hear another case of police misconduct or use of excessive force. It's getting harder and harder to claim that this is not an endemic problem with police forces in the US. (Something I've been saying for years) These events are dismantling the narrative she's constructed, and I think maybe she's not taking it well. That's why she's acting this way.

 

Just a theory, anyway.

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I avoided the other high-publicity police-shooting story because it became clear minutes in that breathless hype was going to overshadow any facts that came out (facts that would be discounted or disbelieved by people if it didn't validate their prejudice anyway).

*Claims to not buy into "breathless hype" when no facts are out*

 

*Posts news story with no confirmed facts and all quotes from the victim's attorney*

 

lol wut crawled up your butt and died this morning?

 

I don't see any protests, looting, race hustling, or 24/7 coverage from Fox and MSNBC casting a pall over this story. It's still more news item than political event. Furthermore, I have never claimed to be unbiased when it comes to police shootings. Never. If there is ever any question about a person they shoot being a threat, they are guilty until proven innocent in my eyes (and yes, my mind can be changed). Unless information is revealed that demonstrates the victim was a threat, I'm going with the attorney's version of events. Not sure why you'd expect anything else or what your problem is. :)

 

That reasoning is atrocious and you know it.

 

I have never claimed to be unbiased when it comes to homosexuality. Never. If there is ever any question about whether a homosexual and their evil sodomy buttsex is being a threat, they are guilty until proven innocent in my eyes (but hey... yes, my mind can be changed! They can't all be field slaves right? Gotta be some house slaves in there).

 

Unless information is revealed that the gays aren't a threat, I'm going with what the church says. After all, they can't possibly be full of sh-t, because they have the word of god!

 

And neither can that attorney. I mean, he can't possibly be thinking about his business and the fact that his name is published in the story like an advertisement! No! Of course not! It's all about the justice!!!! lolololol

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I avoided the other high-publicity police-shooting story because it became clear minutes in that breathless hype was going to overshadow any facts that came out (facts that would be discounted or disbelieved by people if it didn't validate their prejudice anyway).

*Claims to not buy into "breathless hype" when no facts are out*

 

*Posts news story with no confirmed facts and all quotes from the victim's attorney*

 

lol wut crawled up your butt and died this morning?

 

I don't see any protests, looting, race hustling, or 24/7 coverage from Fox and MSNBC casting a pall over this story. It's still more news item than political event. Furthermore, I have never claimed to be unbiased when it comes to police shootings. Never. If there is ever any question about a person they shoot being a threat, they are guilty until proven innocent in my eyes (and yes, my mind can be changed). Unless information is revealed that demonstrates the victim was a threat, I'm going with the attorney's version of events. Not sure why you'd expect anything else or what your problem is. :)

 

I remember a couple of years ago, her trying to argue that cases like this were 'isolated incidents'. And yet, not a week goes by that we don't hear another case of police misconduct or use of excessive force. It's getting harder and harder to claim that this is not an endemic problem with police forces in the US. (Something I've been saying for years) These events are dismantling the narrative she's constructed, and I think maybe she's not taking it well. That's why she's acting this way.

 

Just a theory, anyway.

 

Please quote a post of mine where I've ever said that cases like this are "isolated incidents."

 

Ever.

 

Try google.

 

(P.S. you won't find it. I don't think you exactly get what my point is in this thread).

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That reasoning is atrocious and you know it.

I have never claimed to be unbiased when it comes to homosexuality. Never. If there is ever any question about whether a homosexual and their evil sodomy buttsex is being a threat, they are guilty until proven innocent in my eyes (but hey... yes, my mind can be changed! They can't all be field slaves right? Gotta be some house slaves in there).

 

Unless information is revealed that the gays aren't a threat, I'm going with what the church says. After all, they can't possibly be full of sh-t, because they have the word of god!

 

And neither can that attorney. I mean, he can't possibly be thinking about his business and the fact that his name is published in the story like an advertisement! No! Of course not! It's all about the justice!!!! lolololol

If your little Lyceum fap session today was intended to create some sort of back and forth, I'm sorry. You must have me confused with somebody who is uncomfortable with his personal biases and inconsistencies, with somebody who can be drawn out with your jabs by his desire for your approval. I can make a few suggestions of people you should poke at if it is attention you seek.

 

Of course, if this is just all for your personal gratification, please carry on.

 

:)

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No police would see a white person and instantly not view them as a direct threat. But cops are afraid of black people, and will shoot them more readily than a white person. It's police profiling. And if you think it's not like that then you're naive.

Wahhh waaah wahhh *failed artist pretending to know what it's like to be a black person in the US* wahhhhhhh wah wah whine whine whine
Hahahaha

 

I wasn't whining you horrible ****, just pointing out how it is for other people.

Pointing out how is it for people you have literally no experience with, whatsoever?

 

I mean, correct me if I'm wrong, but do you actually have any real life experience with an economically disadvantaged black person in a confrontation with the police?

 

Or are you, as I suspect, just re-posting random bullsh-t you've heard on the internet?

Uhh, yeah. Like at least once a month.

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I didn't even read the article. I just took Pong at his posted word. :cool:

 

However, I do admit that there are people in public that I would like permission to kind of smack or kick. Not shoot but really from what was posted this guy was leaning on the toy gun. Maybe if I was my grandma I'd have gone up to him and yanked his ear and said, "Stop slouching! What is this? A pubic phone booth? Take that shit outside."

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If your little Lyceum fap session today was intended to create some sort of back and forth, I'm sorry. You must have me confused with somebody who is uncomfortable with his personal biases and inconsistencies, with somebody who can be drawn out with your jabs by his desire for your approval. I can make a few suggestions of people you should poke at if it is attention you seek.

 

Of course, if this is just all for your personal gratification, please carry on.

 

:)

So, you're admitting that your viewpoint is skewed by personal bias and inconsistency then. OK, at least you're a step ahead of Obsidian in that regard.

 

But no, this was not a fap session pong. This was the result of seeing multiple posters spew a bunch of retard downs syndrome, drooling all over yourself gibberish, and attempting to bring a voice of impartial reason to the discussion. An attempt that appears to have failed.. for goodness sake, somehow this thread almost spawned an anti-WalMart tangent.. I'm just like, WTF?.. Wal-Mart wasn't even the point of this story. This thread reminded me of the comments section of news stories you see on Yahoo, you know, the ones that make you question the collective intelligence of humanity.

 

Are you the worst offender, well no, certainly not. I'm not trying to create a back-and-forth, nor am I looking for attention. To be honest, I'm genuinely curious in you. Maybe I've asked you this before and you've already answered me, and if so, clearly I forgot- post a link to a prior thread and I'll go away. But I've always wondered where your border-line pathological obsession with the police comes from. You remind me a lot of tsquare when he was here- remember how he would constantly post every single story he found on the internet that had even the most minute negative thing to say about Obama (and then fill up the entire front page with them?) Really, I'm just curious at this point. Did you have a parking ticket that you had to pay (oh, the horror!) Are you still not over the time you got arrested for that DUI? Are you an actual violent criminal (that would certainly explain you having a significant fear of policemen, no doubt). Did the cops shoot you for toking up in the school gym? That would probably at least give you a justifiable reason for being biased, even though you'd still be irrational and deserve to be looked at skeptically.

 

Now by no stretch of the imagination are you as bad as a tsquare, but you do certainly re-post a significant number of obvious clickbait stories with few (if any) established facts, and inevitably, with each one, you create this fantasy version of events where you invent facts and argue how terrible those facts must've been, and those facts are always some variation of policemen being Gestapo agents eating babies and running over poor little puppies with M1 Abrams tanks, or what have you.

 

I'm not saying a little bit of good ol' fashioned trolling is good now and then, but there is a sheer volume in this case, and besides, we both know that this is something you actually care about. I'm also not saying that you (or Obsidian, or Evolence, or whomever else) never have good points. But there is something to be said for presentation, attention to detail, and attempting to remain level headed or logical and rational. Otherwise, you just end up coming off as incredibly juvenile, you know, like a 16 yr old kid that just had his bong taken away by the local sheriff and has Rage Against the Machine posters in his bedroom. There is no real sophistication to that person and no one will ever take him seriously. It's akin to the Tea Partiers, who endlessly re-forward those chain e-mails about how Obama is a Kenyan or a Muslim (or is it Hitler?) or whatever, or the Occupy Wall Street people, whose understanding of economic malaise only goes about as far as re-tweeting a Huff Post story on their iPhone while pretending to be fighting the man.

 

So sure, I suppose you can be as comfortable in your own personal biases as you'd like, but it'd also mean being comfortable in being grouped in with those aforementioned groups- being a caricature of yourself. Or, in other words, you are aspiring to be about as sophisticated as monkeygirl in how your form opinions. If that's your ambition, then congratulations, you've succeeded.

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I know there is racism but not every shooting involving the police and a black person is racism.

 

Of course not-- but it has been proven time and time again that many police forces use racial profiling in their training. Don't confuse the meaning of racism to mean that white cop hates black suspect. It's systemic-- it goes back decades, racial profiling has been a part of police work since it's early days when racism was prevalent. Police training methodology and basic tactics work in favor of racism. Not universally, but especially in several big cities where race riots have been an issue in the past.

 

It's not as simple as cops shooting black people, it's a complicated situation that has to do with how they are trained to assess situations.

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I agree poor training can be an issue and the fact some people should not be police officers based emotional psychiatric issues.

 

With that being said how many of you who have jobs have been trained for that job? How many times did the training you were taught not help you with a problem you were having? The scenario wasnt in the training? Now imagine if the same thing happened where you have a second to decide on a solution? Welcome to the world of the police and the military face in life and death situations.

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I'll second the "policing themselves" notion. There should be no such thing as "internal investigation" for any suspicious conduct. It should routinely be referred out to a third party investigative branch that isn't buddy-buddy with the suspected officers.

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I'll second the "policing themselves" notion. There should be no such thing as "internal investigation" for any suspicious conduct. It should routinely be referred out to a third party investigative branch that isn't buddy-buddy with the suspected officers.

Yeah movies and TV like to make out Internal Affairs as hated, but they are brethren with their fellow officer. I always thought there should be a division of the FBI that is dedicated to police corruption.

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That's a good breakdown of strawman versus opinion. You should be ashamed for thinking it's good for anything else.

 

If the state takes a life without due process, it should be held to the highest possible standards, and the state should be considered guilty until proven innocent, as the person shot would have been considered innocent until proven guilty.

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Britain has the IPCC, an independent agency that investigates complaints against police. While it is not perfect, and not properly funded, it's still a much better system than letting the police investigate themselves.

 

We need something similar. Each state needs to have an elected commission with broad discretionary powers to investigate allegations made against police, including the ability to appoint special prosecutors outside of the DA's office, and the power to summarily fire any officer who does not cooperate fully with an investigation. A third-party agency outside the police or governor's authority is the only way to ensure that police are held to a higher standard.

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