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Mental Illness?


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Anybody have experience dealing with it? I'm a little bit at my wit's end.

 

To, briefly, set the scene: My mom's been seeing a psychologist for years. She's gone from therapist to therapist, and finally settled on the current one about 7 years ago. She's stated that he wants to see her multiple times a week, but the most she'll go is maybe twice a month, and I'm not entirely sure why she even does that, because she's told me that she has no intention of actually doing anything he tells her to work on.

 

One of the thing she's done all of my life is almost randomly pick someone who has slighted her in some way, real or (more likely) imagined and unleash a lot of hateful words their way, while blaming them for everything. When I was younger, the most likely target was my aunt who also has some major issues, but as we've gotten older it's more and more likely to be one of her children. Right now it's me, because we went to a birthday party on Sunday instead of being home when she wanted to visit. I had asked if she wanted to come to dinner, and she stated she wouldn't come after 7, so when we were still at the party at 6, I texted and asked if she would like to come over on Monday instead. Since then I've gotten 50+ texts, an email and multiple phone calls about how I'm self-centered, I'm an embarrassment to my (deceased) father, and so on. I tried dealing with it rationally, that made her more angry. I tried just accepting it and apologizing, which validated her anger, and made her even worse. I'm now ignoring her, but getting even worse texts as time progresses. I'm really not sure how to react, and at this point I really don't care if I see her again, which I'm told is horrible, and my wife refuses to support, but I don't know what else to do.

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It super sucks that it's your mom treating you like this because if it was any person other than a parent it would be easy for me to say you're justified in pulling the plug on that relationship. Parents are more complicated though.

 

If it were me, I'd probably set up a time to get together 1 on 1 and talk specifics about what type of behavior you find acceptable and what you will not tolerate. The top of that list for me would be 5 texts/day max. That is just insane.

 

I'm sorry she's making things so difficult for you. :(

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Yeah, it super sucks. My dad is very similar. My fix was to move 1000 miles away and simply cut off all contact save for holiday phone calls. It took years, but now he's nice cause he knows if he goes off on me I just don't respond anymore.

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If it were me, I'd probably set up a time to get together 1 on 1 and talk specifics about what type of behavior you find acceptable and what you will not tolerate. The top of that list for me would be 5 texts/day max. That is just insane.

In my experience that doesn't work unless there's a baseline of either rationality or at least desire to make things work, and it appears Brando's mother has long since passed that point. Otherwise, these types of talks just end up badly- either a shuffling duel of passive aggressive comments where both people leave with simmering grudges; or there's a blow up and things end up twice as bad as before.

 

I actually think Tank's advice is the best. Often the best thing to do in such situations is just remove yourself and ignore. One of two things will happen, either a) the person is so attention starved that they will fix said behavior to get back in your good graces, or b) the person will move on to someone else who will pay attention to them. Either way, problem solved.

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One of the thing she's done all of my life is almost randomly pick someone who has slighted her in some way, real or (more likely) imagined and unleash a lot of hateful words their way, while blaming them for everything. When I was younger, the most likely target was my aunt who also has some major issues, but as we've gotten older it's more and more likely to be one of her children. Right now it's me, because we went to a birthday party on Sunday instead of being home when she wanted to visit. I had asked if she wanted to come to dinner, and she stated she wouldn't come after 7, so when we were still at the party at 6, I texted and asked if she would like to come over on Monday instead. Since then I've gotten 50+ texts, an email and multiple phone calls about how I'm self-centered, I'm an embarrassment to my (deceased) father, and so on. I tried dealing with it rationally, that made her more angry. I tried just accepting it and apologizing, which validated her anger, and made her even worse. I'm now ignoring her, but getting even worse texts as time progresses. I'm really not sure how to react, and at this point I really don't care if I see her again, which I'm told is horrible, and my wife refuses to support, but I don't know what else to do.

Are you dealing with mental illness, or a childish asshole who is using "mental illness" as an excuse for their behavior?

 

My gut feeling is that it's a bit of both, but leaning more heavily in the asshole territory.

 

With people like this, you gotta tell them that you simply will not deal with them if they act in an irrational, unfair, and cruel way toward you or your friends, and stick with your promise. It's a pattern, and she's obviously getting something out of acting in that manner. So you need to take away her reward. Shutting her down might take a few times, but she will learn.

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I'm honestly not sure. Or, rather, I'm not sure if this particular behavior is part of her mental illness. She asked me to go to one of her psychologist appointments with her shortly after my dad died, and I did, and her psychologist mentioned in that meeting that he's been trying to get her to see him more frequently for years, so I'd say there is some major mental illness, but I don't know which is which.

 

Right now I'm going the ignore route. Her calls go straight to voicemail, her texts go to my spam folder and her emails skip my inbox as well. I want to have a relationship with her, and when she's not doing this she can be very kind and generous, but then you get this level of stupidity and it's hard to imagine anything else.

 

I also have concern because her main "reason" for being upset is that it was a holiday weekend, which makes her miss my dad and she wanted to see my 13-month old son so he could make her happy. I feel uneasy about putting that kind of burden on a child, regardless of his ability to comprehend at this point. As a toddler, his job is to grow and be happy and have people take care of him, not to take care of his grandmother.

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What was she diagnosed with? Or has she told you?

 

I have several bipolar and manic depressive people who I deal with in my life plus alcoholics.

 

The blaming others is definitely a coping mechanism because it requires them to focus on their problems. It makes them feel better about themselves.

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Surprisingly, she's pretty quiet about the diagnosis. Based on her medication, I'd guess depression, but I'm also fairly certain there are other issues as well that maybe aren't diagnosed because of her lack of cooperation with therapy.

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Heh. We posted at the same time.

 

What you are doing maybe best. You want the kids you raise to be healthy in their relationships. While it is sad that your mother is not able to participate in the relationship, she's not healthy at all. I guess it would be tough love but maybe when she realizes you don't want to enable her or allow her bad behavior to ruin a good relationship, she may change.

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I've dealt with a lot of mental illness-some in myself, some in family and friends.

 

You have every right to do whatever you need to to protect yourself and your child from this behavior, regardless of what anyone thinks. That said, your wife has the right to have a relationship with her MIL, too, but YOU don't need to be part of it. And none of this has to be a permanent arrangement. It can be for now-or just until you can deal or come up with something better.

 

You probably should get a clear idea of her conditions before doing anything permanent. If she's seeing a psychologist, it may not be mental illness. Psychiatrists can only prescribe meds in my state-not psychologists. Yours may differ. It sounds to me like a combo, too-depression/anxiety and some kind of personality disorder is my guess.

 

I disagree with Cashmere-I don't think you talking to her will do anything but make it worse. If she's the type that picks a person to blame everything on, she's used to deflecting when she gets uncomfortable and she'll do it with you and make you crazy angry. She will not grasp what you're trying to say-so it'd be worthless. IF you have a talk-it'd have to be with her therapist present, to set some ground rules.

 

What works for me with situations like this is to find ONE phrase that answers and encapsulates everything you wish to say to her-for now. Repeat it and repeat it and repeat it again. When she tries to ask questions and accuse-repeat it and repeat it. And then repeat it some more. Don't vary from the script-don't give an inch. It may take days or weeks-but they at least get to the point at which they know you're not going to engage in a 'discussion'. This way, she can't twist and deflect.

 

Sample script: Mom, "I'm sorry you're upset about Sunday. I have Monday open and would love to see you. I don't want to argue with you. If Monday isn't good-what works for you?" Don't engage, don't argue, don't explain. Don't vary from the script-not by one word.

 

 

And in the easier-said-than-done area: I wouldn't do anything to keep her from her Grandson, unless you feel he'd be in real danger. He's too young to realize he's being used to make Grandma feel better so that'll have no effect on him. It doesn't compromise him at this age-it's just bad for her. Accomodate their relationship as well as you can. This doesn't have anything to do with him. Adjust that as he ages, appropriately.

 

Whatever's up with her-she isn't behaving rationally and there's no reason for anyone to put up with that IF she isn't doing anything at all to help herself. Also-have a chat with her therapist about her progress-or lack of.

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I have never dealt with a similar situation before, but I can't imagine cutting my mom out of my life without at least trying to get her to understand how her choices are hurting the relationship. I would have to try something to feel okay about the final decision if it came to that.

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My Mom totally got cut from my life for five years. She was an alcoholic and very bad for me. I had to wait to reestablish a relationship when I was stronger and could do what I could and recognize signs that were not healthy when I was ready. It is not ideal. But kids really do pick up on strains in relationships with parents and familial type things like Brando and his Mom.

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She called to apologize. I kept it brief, told her that I accepted and forgave her, and ended the conversation quickly. Luckily it was storming and I was driving.

 

Still not entirely sure how I want it to go.

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Whether thru illness, stress or intoxicants when you're not in your Right Mind you're not All You. Sometimes you are you but a worse you or something like that, you do what you are prone to, but sometimes you really aren't you. I promise to make a point. Sounds like your Mom has issues throughout life and so the Mom you know could be her or it could be her made worse or not even her true personality... depending entirely on numerous factors we obviously don't need real details on, but maybe the first step in this is understanding that what a person says or does isn't necessarily what that person wants to say or do.

 

Without being in a movie where you can slap someone back to their Right Mind or you're lucky enough to have a cure-all hypospray we all just need to set the limits for what we can take from others so we don't in turn impede our own lives. Not certain anyone looking at you can truly say where the line should be. Pretty certain you shouldn't be scorned for drawing a line, but am 1. Not a woman and 2. Not your wife, so you should probably pay heed to her scorn and not tell her I said she shouldn't pick on you about how you draw lines... unless you draw squiggles. Squiggles aren't lines, MoFo, so stop that.

 

On a personal note I come from a crazy family. This comes as a total surprise to you all I am sure, but yes it is true not a Torchy Parable. When you have to draw that line and someone you love is on the other side, even if at the moment you might not love them so much, it hurts and that never goes away. I'm told I am a Weak Heart, however, because I draw lines and then I build doors on them... you know so people can visit. It could be different this time. Usually this results in Doors In My Face, but I just can't bring myself to build a moat.

 

I guess what I'm rambling here is that you seem to be in a situation that will require a bunch of Trial & Error until you figure out an acceptable balance. There's no easy out here, it's gonna hurt and it only really hurts less not ever feels great. I hope you can find the right approach for you and your family sooner rather than later. My thoughts and prayers.

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My best friend recently had to write her mother a letter explaining that she could no longer continue having a relationship with her. Her mother has always been bipolar, and is extremely judgmental, selfish, closed-minded, and manipulative, as well. She has never been on medication or gone to a psychologist because she doesn't see that she has any issues that need to be changed. I swear, the woman LIKES being miserable because of all the drama she can cause. Jen has tried hard to ignore all that. She has spent her entire life trying to please her mother, trying not to say things that set her off, but nothing she does is ever good enough. Talking to her mother on the phone, even when the woman is in one of her better moods, has become such a trial that Jen would be depressed for days afterward. Finally, for the sake of her own mental health, she simply cut off all ties with her. She feels much better now without her mom's negativity, snide comments, and constant need for drama and pity.

 

I see similar elements in the description of your own mother. Because she is miserable, she thrives on making others miserable. Because she doesn't understand that she needs to change her behavior, she jumps at the chance to criticize everyone else's. If you do something nice for her, does she criticize it? If you compliment her on something she is wearing, does she make a disparaging comment in return? I hate to say it, but at some point, you are going to realize that trying to please her is not only impossible, but is bad for your own mental health. And what if she turns her vitriol to your grandson at some point? He makes her happy now because he is a baby and he can't say or do anything that she can find fault with. If she is like my friend's mother, though, she is only good with kids until the age when they can start to exhibit some independence and self-will; at that point, she'll lose interest in him and just find reasons to blame and criticize him for whatever. I know people will disagree with that, and say that he should have his grandma in his life, but why? Just because you are related to someone, doesn't mean you have to put up with their bull****. So you will have to decide if having her in your son's life is in HIS best interest as well as yours.

 

Oh, and I like MG's idea of sticking to a script every time you do talk to your mother. Eventually, she'll get the idea that you aren't going to cave in to her childish need for drama and she might start leaving you alone.

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My ex's father is a manic depressive personality. He is extremely negative and I do not enjoy being around him. But I am still close to him and his wife as they were extremely giving people too. Helping my Mom during some of the most difficult times in her life when she needed it. I remember the good times. Over the years, I've given them hundreds of dollars and helped every chance I could by taking them out to eat (they consider it entertainment). They helped me too when my ex and I broke it off.

 

Anyways.

 

I think we are all touched in some way by someone who has issues coping and mental stability issues. It would be interesting to go back in to your mothers history to see what was there. It maybe that she never learned good coping skills and has some personality disorder but it is dangerous to armchair diagnose.

 

If you can get a list of questions together there are church's that offer free counseling services that may be able to point you in the direction to get a little help.

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Cereese asked me to weigh in here, since I'm working toward my counseling license. Honestly, I think what MG said is truly spot on. She brought up a lot of excellent points and suggestions that I fully support, and there isn't anything more I would add other than STRONGLY suggesting scheduling an appointment with a counselor for yourself. This is a hard situation with a lot of history feeding it (it must have been hard growing up with a mother that acted like that), and a professional can help you not only deal with and proceed in the current situation, but also overcome the difficulties both past and present have afforded you. Please consider this option for your own well being.

 

My best to you as you work through this!!

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My suspicion would be that an Axis II disorder (personality) might be responsible for the primary suite of symptoms, but there could be an underlying Axis I disorder as well (affective disorder like depression, disthymia, bipolar). Since she has been rather mum on the diagnosis, you might try calling the therapist. Due to privacy laws, they will not be able to divulge specifics to you. But you could explain some of the difficult behavior you're dealing with, and the therapist might could recommend a book that would help you cope with her diagnosis (without directly saying this is what your mother has). I know that "Walking on Egg Shells" is a book for family/friends of those with Borderline Personality Disorder. I'm quite certain there would be similar books for other disorders that are geared towards the friends and family.

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You could also check out and see if there are any local NAMI chapters that have meetings. It's like AA for crazy people-- sans all the God talk and 12 steps. Attendees can range from people who are suffering with mental illness to the family and friends who live with a person suffering. These meetings can be very therapeutic, and in some regions they have educational seminars lasting several months that is sort of like a deep dive into the what's what of mental illness.

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My mother went through this with her mother. I won't get into all the run-of-the-mill details, but the situation was never really fixed. They would just go a year, or two, or three without talking to each other, then they would just get over it and not really get into why things went sour, and it would inevitably repeat. It wasn't my mother's fault, but I know it hurt her when she was younger. She's older and wise enough to not let it under her skin anymore. It wasn't a situation that could be fixed by sitting down and logically working through things. My grandmother is just about dead and there is still some friction, so I hope your situation goes better than that. My grandmother is from the depression/ww2 era, they absolutely don't get counseling. The situation you have described is extremely similar to what she went through, deceased father and all.

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OH-and DON'T blame yourself or let yourself guilt-trip over how you decide to handle this. She's not rational and just because she's your mother; that isn't reason enough to let her damage your life. I can't imagine having to cut off a parent entirely. I've gotten by with my Mom for years with limited contact and it's worked for us. She's almost 100% rational now and we get along fine. I'd just really like a full, clear apology from her but I've seen that's never coming so I'm now trying to be fine with the notion it's not happening and enjoy the years we have left.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

Just a quick note Fozzie, I am sorry you have that situation with your mom. I can't add much to what others have said, but I can say that while not nearly the same situation as you, I have had some difficult times over the years dealing with my dad. Depression runs deep on his side of the family, and he has a number of health issues that cause him to lash out at times, both because of his frustration, and because of his mental health. This includes physical ailments like a bad heart, disabling neuropathy, and what I believe to be early stages of dementia (caused by both falling from neuropathy, and neuropathy itself).

 

On one hand, he can't help it when he is difficult, on another, it doesn't give him the right to be hurtful towards me or other members of my family. I have found that at times, I must take a week or two off from speaking or visiting with him, when we have disagreements. This gives us both a chance to cool down. I do tell him that it isn't alright to treat me that way, though. The point of all that is basically I think the way you are handling your situation is all you really can do. I wouldn't advocate cutting all ties, but for your own piece of mind, when necessary, you should take a break from your mom when she becomes abusive, and if possible (you are best able to judge if this will work) tell her why you are taking a break.

 

In any event, I hope things get better for you.

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