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So anyone else out right hate or get why I figured what I did for a revision?

 

The more I thought about it the more I wanted so badly for Reed to be African-American because while I dig MBJ as Johnny, is it really something pop culture hasn't seen before? It's just Eddie Murphy flaming on. I want to reassert another role, I want the Geordi LaForge, I want the Cliff Huxtable. Just about any role by Andre Braugher. I want Neil Degrasse Tyson, but young and obviously heroic. I went Asian for Sue and Johnny, Hawaiian raised character wise, as a way to just sprinkle in the idea of newer generations of Americans. I kinda figure this Sue and Johnny might only be 3rd generation, with perhaps linking them straight to the IRL immigration of post-WWII into Hawaii.

 

That also affords me the idea of getting out of New York for once. Everything is so New York based in Marvel. I wouldn't even have Reed in New York, I was thinking more like he would be operating from New Mexico or some other area like that where there is a strong history of American scientific experimentalism and isolation from populations. But that desire to bump out of New York is why I stressed so heavily that Grimm has to bleed the Big Apple (it's why I ideally favor someone like Edward Burns). That New York link has to stay so strong to continue that throw back, that familiarity. Eventually I would want to slide back up to New York, founding the Baxter Building and all that, but I want to just be no where near it at first.

 

I went with mixing South American and Polynesian cultures for Atlanteans because usually everyone goes Greek inspired, but I figure we could really get a great look here by melding the lores of those paradise cultures. Also by doing so we should get something so very different than the more traditional Atlantean look that DC does with Aquaman. And yeah, I'd want the The Rock for Namor.

 

Anyway, just having some fun here. These things are like brain games for me. BubbleBath day dreams. LOL

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See that is part of the problem. Putting grit and Fantastic Four together is like describing Superman as a murderer. Wait. Well, ****...

ive never said this to anybody before brett but your bowel movements sound amazing

Which is the stupidest excuse ever. People kinda forget that Sue was 19, and Johnny 16 when FF #1 came out in 1962. Reed is 6 years older than Sue (they first met when he was 19 and working for her da

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Your ideas sure seem like ideas to me, Torch! A multi-culti FF (especially in a cinematic adaptation) sounds good! Your take on the Atlanteans reminds me a little bit of the design elements for that Disney animated film with Michael J. Fox as the intrepid explorer - this film

 

I want the Geordi LaForge

NOBODY WANTS GEORDI

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Damnit, I forgot about Disney's Atlantis. That's why I love the cultural mix idea for Atlanteans so much, I've seen it work. Well you know what they say about Monkeys at Typewriters that probably can be updated to Geeks at Keyboards.

 

By the way, there's always room for Geordi, he's like jello. Afro-Jello... fuck that is a funky name. If City of Heroes still existed I'd be playing that hero right now. His theme would be perfomed by a holographic George Clinton whenever danger was near.

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You are so wrong. GEORDI LA FORGE IS THE WORST.

 

Evidence : shot down by multiple holographic girlfriends, own mother died rather than be around for him to bother, has no friends (at most he's got a robot and a teenager), crashed his own funeral ("Hey guys, I know there's no real reason for all of you to take time off and hang around in Ten Forward now that I'm alive but ... KEEP PARTYING BECAUSE THIS IS MY ONE CHANCE!"), both his engineering heroes tried desperately to get away from him because he's so awful, kidnapped SO MANY TIMES you have to wonder if maybe the rest of the crew just wanted him out of the way.

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Is that list of Awful or Awesome?

 

All that has happened to him and he's still ticking away doing his work, making miracles happen... WITHOUT multiplying repair estimates by a factor of four. I mean, is he Data's best friend or is Data his best friend? You know there's a difference. That's right, Data would be an impassive Pinocchio without Geordi. Do you recall that one time a broken Data tortured Geordi near to death and Geordi forgave him? Reminds me of another man with a name that starts with G and ends in I. No, not Jesus. If you said that you suck at spelling.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Now is the uproar because Johnny Storm is now black or is it because his sister is still white? What if they made Sue Storm black as well? Would that calm the uproar because they would both be black or would there be double the hate?

 

Had an associate at work ask me how blacks would react if the Falcon in the new Captain America movie was white. I said "what? The 5% that know who the Falcon is?" Lol.

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Here's my handy guide to racial relations in comics...

 

 

Black Panther can't be anything but black

Captain America can't be anything but white

Everything else is up for grabs

 

Fantastic Four specifically:

 

black Johnny, black Sue = cool

white Johnny, white Sue = cool

black Johnny, white Sue = cool, so long as they drop a line that one of them is adopted

white Johnny, black Sue = cool, so long as they drop a line that one of them is adopted

dough-faced Reed and scrawny Ben = bad news

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Ah. But seeing as the Falcon filled in for Cap for a while, you can say we have had a black Captain America.

Those were some of the best stories too-- I'd actually be fine with Mackie taking over as Cap if Evans stepped down. That would be cool. I just meant establishing the mythos with the original guy from world war 2 it would make sense he was the then-model of all-American.

 

Poor oppressed white people. How are they going to survive this?

 

That being said everything about this movie still looks awful.

Really, at the end of the day this. I said it above, I have FAR more issues with the Reed and Ben casting and the fact that the FF has never been that interesting to me to begin with than I have with a black Johnny Storm.

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Personally I think DC should go with John Stewart instead off Hal Jordan for Justice League. Not a black or white thing. Just thought that Stewart was a more relatable(not race wise) Lantern. Of course that's as I got older. Green Lantern is my favorite supe so I have no qualms with either. And an interracial interspecies relationship with Hawk girl would be interesting to say the least.

 

My question is can they come up with a FF story that doesn't bore.

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I would put Batman, Bruce Wayne that is, as a white dude... at least if the story is taking place right now. Reason? His backstory is born from a very long line of American Aristocrats, it's dishonest and IMO disrespectful to IRL Civil Rights struggles to make him anything but white at the moment.

 

Same sorta thing said for Captain America, Steve Rogers that is. He doesn't come from a long line of American Aristocrats, but he's chosen to be the poster boy for America and a super experiment during the 1940s and WWII... it's dishonest and disrepectful to IRL Civil Rights struggles to make him anything but white.

 

Dick "Robin" Grayson could be anything because he's from circus folk. The New 52 screws that up a bit I believe by making his family tied to Gotham Aristocrats, but traditionally he's a carnie. He could be Russian, he could be Greek, he could be Turkish, he could be Arabian, he could be African. etc etc. I personally adore the idea that he's a 2nd Generation Immigrant with his parents being Ruska Roma aka Russian Gypsies.

 

I think the Fantastic Four can be any ethnicity, I prefer Johnny and Sue to be from the same ethnicity, blood related. However pigmentation differences don't have to imply adoption either. I have nieces and nephews that are mixed; my oldest niece is a peachy tone, blonde and blue eyed. Her brothers are caramelish toned, dark haired and brown eyed. My other nieces and nephews are a coffee w/cream sort of tone. Genetically it's all how the building blocks just decide to fit together. And they fit together great because my neices and nephews are stunningly gorgeous.

 

Anyway, I look at these things with the characters in mind first and foremost. The biographies of the characters sometimes demand certain things. I think there is a saying about truth in art, these characters are of course fictional but they are grounded with certain realities.

 

Edit: Autocorrects everything, but neices it was okay with. Stupid iPhone. Oh. Now it wants to underline it, fuck you Apple. Like I don't look dumb enough and now I can't even rely on you.

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I don't think anybody here thinks you're dumb, Torch. A little crazy, but not dumb!

 

And in answer to Met, I'm sure that there are some people who are offended because Johnny Storm is black, and I'm sure that there are some people who are offended because he doesn't have the right hair. Some people take that even more seriously than our Torch! And there are probably a few people who hate it for absolute racist reasons, but I would venture that they're a minority.

 

A big part comes from the fact that the only thing Fox has gotten right in superhero movies is Hugh Jackman and Patrick Stewart.

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Far as I'm concerned, they can make the FF all black, as long as the movie doesn't suck.

 

Idris Elba as Reed; Kerry Washington as Sue; Terry Crews as Ben; Michael B. Jordan as Johnny. The new film from director John Singleton.

 

Boom. Done. Five stars.

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Allow me to offer some sort of blacksplanation. It's totally cool to change a white person (ANY ****ING WHITE PERSON) into any other race in an adaptation or a reboot or whatever while still being uncool (or, y'know, WRONG) to change a whatever-other-race person into a white person in an adaptation or reboot or whatever. gasp shock what how can this be?

 

There's a metric ton of white fictional characters out there. Most of the entertainment any of the people reading the words I'm typing here are going to consume is gonna just feature a whole mess of white people. White people are basically the default setting for fictional characters in the stuff we're gonna read or watch or play or whatever. If your favourite white character is turned into a black (or crafty oriental or taciturn injun) you're still left with a great big myriad of whiteness out there to enjoy and rejoice in. But there are fewer minority (or, majority, whatever) characters out there so if one of them gets whitewashed your pile of minority characters has been substantially diminished and all just to add a mere drop to the giant bucket of white characters which towers over your small pile of minority characters.

 

Like, put it this way : if I give you a thousand apples and then decide at the last second to take two of 'em back and you complain you're an ingrate. You have nine hundred and ninety .... eight apples! Go enjoy one of those apples like a Sherlock Holmes apple or a Tintin apple or a Gandalf apple or a King Arthur apple or an Anne of Green Gables apple or a Patrick Bateman apple or a Jeeves & Wooster apple or a Hamlet apple or the James Bond apples. But if I give seven apples to someone else and then decide at the last second to take three back and he complains he's kind of got a point. P.S. In this analogy his missing apples are Conner Hawke, Ryan Choi, and the collective cast of the Airbender movie.

 

P.P.S. Now follows my shortlist of comics characters I would snap my fingers and make black :

 

Doctor Fate

Captain Marvel Juniour

Christian Walker

Dakota North

Sally Floyd

Wolverine

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Personally I think DC should go with John Stewart instead off Hal Jordan for Justice League. Not a black or white thing. Just thought that Stewart was a more relatable(not race wise) Lantern. Of course that's as I got older. Green Lantern is my favorite supe so I have no qualms with either. And an interracial interspecies relationship with Hawk girl would be interesting to say the least.

 

My question is can they come up with a FF story that doesn't bore.

I especially enjoyed John Stewart in Cosmic Odyssey. fuck, Warners should adapt that and beat Marvel to the punch.
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In response to RC I know what is talking about I regards to characters of color replacing white characters and not the other way around. But here is what gets lost. For the most part the "traditionally" white character is usually "just a guy". If the character of color is in a lead or supporting role, their ethnicity is usually part of the story. For most people The Kingpin is just large mob guy. Michael Clarke Duncan just happened to be back. And even a Morgan Freeman or Denzel Washington can play men who were white in the books. Though they took out the romantic aspect in The Pelican Brief, And they make a playful jab that Redd was Irish in Shawshank. But while there are numerous Freeman, Washington roles that could be played by whites, imagine the response to Brad Pitt were to play Hoke in a Driving Miss Daisy remake.

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My question is can they come up with a FF story that doesn't bore.

 

Get Dr Doom right this time and it might have a shot. But the FF has really aged horribly in general. Just about every other Marvel bigshot has managed to get a modern verison that works... except the FF. Not counting the Four from the Fantastick in "Marvel 1602" that is. (THAT is a movie I´d love to see!)

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