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No. No. That's not true. That's impossible.

We all have limits to our suspension of disbelief. Even you, Justus, would balk eventually at something. Don't get haughty and brag how you'll just "let SW7 unfold as whatever it has to be." Storytell

What about Tank's notes? That is the most important question here.

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So do I. TPM and its flaws weren't helped by the massive hype train and details that were provided by Lucas and company. It is soemthing that I do like about Abrams productions, with most details being kept close to the vest.

 

At the same time, though, I am looking forward to getting some information as we get closer.

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Guest El Chalupacabra

The force awakens. Is that to mean that it was sleeping for thirty years? If so, that makes the whole "Luke hiding from himself" theory all the more plausible.

 

That is exactly what went through my mind: the idea of the title giving legitimacy to a rumor about a plot element I find distasteful.

 

But others here are right. No Star Wars title has been good, and they are supposed to be throwbacks to the titles of 1930s and 1940s serial sci fi films, so I am still willing to give this next film a chance. I hope it is awesome. But if after the opening scrawl, we see a severed hand gripping a lightsaber floating thru space, or we find Luke has become a force-hermit for 30 years and done nothing while the galaxy has burned, I swear to god....

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I would like to see Luke be a reluctant hero. He tries to stay aloof, he's cranky and shows an attitude like he's too old, or it's hopeless, the force is too dangerous; but he tags along helping the young heroes, training them while at the same time annoying them a bit with pessimism...but by doing so becomes the perfect mentor training great Jedi in record time and steering them clear of the dark side. His character evolves and recaptures his heroism by the end of the movie, commanding his newly trained Jedi, barking orders, kicking ass and taking names, and making the ultimate sacrifice saving their skins at the very end, becoming one with the force like Obi-Wan did. Because that's what Luke knows and he learned from the best.

 

Wow, I just made myself cry just then.

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Even during the celebration, he was a little distant though. So there is still room there.

 

I don't want dark sad loner Luke though.

 

The problem you run into having a happy go lucky Luke however, is having to answer the question as to what the hell has he been doing for the last 30 years and why hasn't he tried to teach other Jedi (or Leia?). Story-wise it's probably better to start out with a mysterious new slate then with 40 minutes of exposition.

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He was definitely aloof at the end of ROTJ. He was staring at dead people in the corner until his sister dragged him back to the celebration.

 

Sure a lot can change in 30 years, but why go that way? What would be the point--just to be edgy or whatever? That's not what the OT was aiming at. If they wanted Luke to go off and become a hermit/crazy/whatever, he wouldn't have returned to the celebration on Endor. He would've gone off on his own.

 

The OT established old Jedi as EXACTLY that, quirky loners that keep a low profile. The point would to show how much Luke has taken to Ben and Yoda's example, and his lack of ability to deal with the fact he's the last Jedi...a powerful one at that, with no other living Jedi to work with or keep him in check. This makes him dubious of himself and his ability to train others; which is why he hasn't. The struggle in the film would force his hand and make him find his confidence and train a new savior.

 

I personally prefer something like the Jedi described above to Luke running a Jedi college like in the EU. That is fine for the books, but I find the character I described above more interesting for a two hour movie. It shows character evolution after the last movie, given the time gap, and evolution throughout the film that echoes some themes from the OT.

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I'm not that staunch about it either way. As long as it doesn't start with a fully functional Jedi academy with teachers and students practicing saber techniques and force push all over machu picchu. I just never thought that would be plausible. luke had very little training himself, and he's going to start an academy? He'd be terrible at it. If this were the premise of the movie, the rest of it would probably be about one of the students falling to the dark side because the academy failed, and someone would have to go take him out. This is all very meh to me.

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I love the idea of Luke having a crisis of confidence at some point between the movies and basically leaving. Yoda telling Luke to pass on what he's learned doesn't really matter either, we know Luke doesn't always listen to Yoda anyway.

 

I like how everything wa seemingly gone to hell. The idea of the Empire falling and then a new Republic being formed is boring and far fetched anyway. It's more likely that the Galaxy would have gone into chaos, kinda like Iraq.

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Luke having a crisis of confidence makes him a pretty ****ty hero, imo.

 

Luke is an idealist. Luke is the one who really brought balance to the Force. Luke, Luke, he's our man. If he can't do it, no one can.

 

Now, if there's a good reason for all of this okay. But don't open Episode VII up with Luke gone and offer me some crappy half-hearted explanation like "It was hard, he gave up."

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Luke had a crisis of confidence in ESB during his training on Dagobah, then regained it for ROTJ. Still a hero. It's just the ups and downs of his story arc and it was the best part of the trilogy. His character was truly tested. This is what I want from him again, except from a different angle, the role of mentor. If you think I'm saying I want him to be a loser and quit the force for thirty years, then you're missing the point. I want the struggle and I want it on camera along with the turnaround.

 

"it was hard, he gave up?" No...how about he took on an apprentice once who turned to the dark side. When he Luke had to put him down he made a choice to wait for the right person, or wait for he himself to improve, or he figured no force in the galaxy is better than risking the dark side or whatever. There's plenty of ways to fill in the blanks there, it's not going to be on camera. Then the film starts, the new threat (whatever it is) in the film forces Luke to finally dig deep and successfully pass the torch...maybe even with a little help from force Yoda. That is hardly half-hearted, it's heroic.

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Luke having a crisis of confidence makes him a pretty ****ty hero, imo.

 

Luke is an idealist. Luke is the one who really brought balance to the Force. Luke, Luke, he's our man. If he can't do it, no one can.

 

Now, if there's a good reason for all of this okay. But don't open Episode VII up with Luke gone and offer me some crappy half-hearted explanation like "It was hard, he gave up."

"This one a long time have I watched. All his life has he looked away... to the future, to the horizon. Never his mind on where he was. Hmm? What he was doing. Hmph. Adventure. Heh. Excitement. Heh. A Jedi craves not these things. You are reckless."

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It's funny, because all the "explanations" I've heard about why Luke would not be training Jedi, would be a hermit, etc. are all things that were done in the EU. And the whole point of ditching the EU was to do something DIFFERENT.

 

I personally love the idea of a Jedi Academy and Luke being the one to start it. If it doesn't happen until the Sequel Trilogy, fine. But I really want Luke to have trained Jedi by 30 years after Return of the Jedi. AT LEAST Leia, for crying out loud. I mean, heck, he could have met up with some other Force sensitives or Jedi-in-exile and they all trained together.

 

I mean, people complain about Rebels and the fact that is has two Force sensitive characters, and what does this mean for Luke being the "new hope." And Dave Filoni responds that they are very cognizant of this. So people obviously want Luke to be the only Jedi around during the OT...but then he's not going to actually rebuild the Jedi Order after it's finished? That doesn't make any sense to me. If you sit a random person down and ask what they think happens after the OT, they'd say Han and Leia get married and Luke becomes a Jedi master. Going the expected way doesn't mean the movie is going to be boring. Hell, another doom-and-gloom movie with a reluctant/anti-hero would be boring. Turning Luke into an anti-Luke would be boring.

 

Now, like Lucas said, if they could come up with a good explanation, that's one thing. But I'm really hoping to see a family saga, and the Skywalkers/Solos working together.

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One fear I had about these movies is that theyd be repetitive. That basically there would be a new republic and a new Jedi order and at score point someone tried to take it over and one of the Jedi turned to the darkside and basically we retell the story of the previous 6 movies condensed into 3 movies.

 

That doesn't seem to be the case, it does seem like this story will still essentially deal with the consequences of defeating the Emperor and if you take it a step further back to the consequences of Anakin turning to the darkside.

 

If you look at how the Emperor turned the Galaxy into an empire he didn't burn the republic down all at once. He used the systems and government of the republic to his advantage. He didn't get rid of the senate for about 20 years. Now when he is debated theyd basically have to start over, there is no Senate any more. The Galaxy is controlled by regional governors, appointed by the Emperor. The idea that a new republic was formed and Luke trained Jedi to protect it is far fetched.

 

How it pertains to Luke would be interesting. The questions Luke would ask himself are numerous. First and foremost is simply is the force too much power for anyone to have? Is he the right person to have this power? Is he capable of training new Jedi capable of having this power responsibly?

 

Now if he answers any of these questions no and decides to Galaxy is better off without him, it doesn't mean he's not a hero. It means he is a human being. And if one of the plot elements of this movie is him overcoming his doubts, that could be interesting. A few people have commented that there needs to be a good explanation. Well, obviously. That'd goes for any plot element in any movie ever made. But I doubt the reason is "Luke left, he just couldn't tadke setting his alarm early every morning for those early training sessions".

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The questions you pose are not really relevant to how things work in Star Wars. Luke can turn away from his destiny and fail, or he can do what he was intended to do... how does he know what he's intended to do? Star Wars is to the point about that, no Force User has to guess, the Force tells them what it wants done. Beyond his choice he is the right person to wield power etc, the Force has a will and it put Luke in that position with... let's say, Divine Authority. Again, Luke can turn away and yes failing is part of being alive but to do so on that scale would be against the will of the Force and thus evil.

 

Also the character arc which is suggested here is a retread of Luke's arc from the OT. He's been down this path and stood trimuphant already.

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It's funny, because all the "explanations" I've heard about why Luke would not be training Jedi, would be a hermit, etc. are all things that were done in the EU. And the whole point of ditching the EU was to do something DIFFERENT.

When was Luke a non-training hermit in the EU? Maybe he didn't train anyone in the early days, but that was just because it simply hadn't happened yet. I don't remember him ever living as a hermit, though. If they want to do something different, the hermit thing would be drastically different from the Grand Master Luke of the EU.

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A few people have commented that there needs to be a good explanation. Well, obviously. That'd goes for any plot element in any movie ever made. But I doubt the reason is "Luke left, he just couldn't tadke setting his alarm early every morning for those early training sessions".

 

 

You're right. The point I was trying to make was that if that's the route they go down, I'll hold that to a much higher standard than I would other things because it isn't a plot point I care to see. Obviously whichever path they choose needs to be explained well.

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I guess that's the difference between me and some others, I don't really care what I see as long as it's done well. Obviously within reason, I don't want too see Luke become male stripper or something. I just don't get the whole "that's not who Luke is" thing. People are complicated and if they just do exactly what we expect them to do all the time they are boring and not realistic.

 

The Luke of the OT was young, he had the optimism of youth. Ofcourse he thought "I can defeat the emperor and turn my dad good eventhough Yoda and Ben say I cant". Because that's the irrational confidence and optimism of youth. That gets driven out of a lot of people as they get older. It's certainly reasonable this could happen to Luke.

 

I think pepole love Luke so much they want to see him with no flaws. He essentially has no real flaws in the OT. His main flaw is basically caring about his friends too much and being young. The idea of as he got older maybe he wasn't perfect, maybe he wasn't a great teacher. I think that's interesting.

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