That's my thing, Brad. These positions already have such a limited impact (a 24 point day is very rare). Penalties against other positions aren't felt as much, because they score more. Plus, it's really not the same all the way around. A RB or a WR is generally only going to be penalized for a lost fumble - a pretty infrequent occurrence. They could still have a crappy day in plenty of ways - 2.0 yards a carry, dropped passes. None of that will hurt them in fantasy, though. On the other hand, take my Ravens D/ST today. They had a pretty good day in real life: didn't give up a TD, only surrendered 15 points total, only allowed 3.5 yards a rush and 4.5 yards a pass. Yet, what did they do for my fantasy team? A whopping 2 points. T-w-o.
The average points allowed per team last season in the NFL was 21.5. We start deducting points at 22.
With regards to your D/ST this week, whilst the Ravens may have not given up a TD, had great yardage averages they still only got 1 sack, 0 turnovers and allowed 5 drives to end in FG. And they lost (Although I appreciate this is mainly due to Flacco being ****). Turnovers, sacks, safeties etc are all the most important part of a fantasy team's D/ST. There are plenty of ways they could have scored points, but they didn't. I do think that this maybe pushes forwards a case for maybe changing the limits for points scored and deductions, but still not completely removed.
Whilst a bad game doesn't cost any of the other positions points it still hampers their ability to score. When you rely on these players to make a larger contribution to your score this can hurt you even more than a kicker being docked a few points.
There was a game I had one year that would've been a tie, except my kicker missed a 49 yard FG and lost a point. How is this at all comparable to the other positions? I just don't understand why some people are so opposed to making these two positions a little more relevant. Even if we take away the deductions, they're going to still be far behind most other positions in terms of impact. Yet, as I said in the other thread, they constitute a 1/4 of your lineup. If we go through the bother of having them on our team, why not let them have a little more importance?
I think that having deductions makes them even more relevant!
Your kicker missed a 49 yard FG and lost you the game. If he is trying a 49 yard FG then the game was probably lost for his real team too! It's little things like that that make it even better and much more realistic. I don't see why this realism makes this less practical. The conditions are the same for everyone and I think most people will have had a game where a D/ST or kicker has lost them the game.
UKLK, it's not just when it results in a negative total that bothers me. It's the whole deduction thing, because it further hamstrings two positions that are already fairly limited on average. As I've said, even without taking points away from them, their fantasy impact is nowhere near their real life importance. And the penalties enforced aren't comparable to other (already higher scoring) positions. A QB could complete less than half of his passes, a WR could drop 4 balls, a RB could fumble 3 times - and provided someone with the same color jersey falls on the ball, in every case it will represent a horrible day in real life and yet have no fantasy "repercussions".
A missed FG does not lose points for a team and again, is basically the same as going for it on 4th and not getting it - which happens often and has no bearing on fantasy football. Missing a 49 yards FG is not shocking - after all, it's hardly a gimme - yet it costs fantasy teams. Allowing 22 points hardly seems like such a crime when you consider that the average team in the NFL last year allowed half a point less every week. So, no. I would not agree that the deductions are deserved, consistent, or necessary.
A fumble that your team recovers costs you no points because it has cost you very little in the grand scheme of things. A missed FG has lost you the chance of getting more points. Within the same scoring system you have to be consistent. Whilst many incompletions, a dropped pass or a fumble may not cost a QB/RB/WR/TE any points it does limit their ability to score. If they hadn't have made that mistake then the drive may have continued and they could have gained more points.
A kicker has very little opportunity to make an impact, so their scoring ability is lower than the other positions. At the same time they are heavily relied on to convert their opportunities as it is such a specialised and specific position. They convert then they get the points, they miss and they are deducted points because they were expected to not miss. In the same way a RB is expected not to fumble, a QB is expected not to be intercepted. Obviously this changes due to the distance, and so do the points deductions.
(I'm quite enjoying this debate BTW)