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Star Trek XI


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#51
Alien Face

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The book Star Trek: Nemesis ended like this:

In the aftermath of the Scimitar incident while in drydock....

"Picard did not know if he should have looked upon the B4 with disgust or pitty"

He left the room and then went to meet the new Commander Michael Madden.

The last line of the book:

"But what he did not know was that in Data's quarters the B4 was singing"

"Never saw the sun....."

The movie ending:

Picard talks with B4 and sees that he is trying to sing the song Data sung at the wedding and helps him remember the lyrics. He then leaves the room again to greet the new commander but has an ominous grin on his face; implying that Data isn't trully gone.

Geordi even says:

"This is a lot of information for B4 to compute. Remember. He's a prototype."

It's amazing that 4 years later I can recall the book almost perfectly.

Now here's an idea that I have not seen anywhere else. A reshoot of key scenes involving Data and his supposed demise along with a re-edit of the entire film. Just a thought.

Edited by Alien Face, 01 October 2006 - 05:00 PM.


#52
The Maker

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What I got from the end of the last exchange between Picard and B4 was also of Picard's hope, as he helped B4 with the lyrics of the song Data had been singing. I took that to symbolize that part of Data that lives on in B4. B4 may be a prototype and may not be as advanced as Data, but Soong's androids were created with one distinct purpose: to evolve. Data had evolved tremendously in the 15 years from when he first joined the Enterprise crew to his demise. I find it hard to believe that the same desire to evolve was not also impressed upon B4.

#53
Decoy Octopus

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Events that will occur before a DS9 movie:

Someone will be able to explain why on earth Rachael Ray has a career.

:P



Because she's hot :pimp:

#54
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Who are your favourite ST villains from the films?

Mine:
1) KAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHNNNNNN!!! (Ricardo Montalban) ~ II
2) General Chang (Christopher Plummer) ~ VI
3) Borg Queen (Alice Krige) ~ First Contact
4) Kruge (Christopher Lloyd) ~ III
5) Soran (Malcolm McDowell) ~ Generations
6) Sybock (Laurence Luckinbill) ~ V
7) Shinzon (Tom Hardy) ~ Nemesis
8) Ad'har Ru'afo (F Murray Abraham) ~ Insurrection
9) V'Ger (Voyager 6) ~ I
10) The Probe (Giant beer can with soccer ball attached to it) ~ IV

Edited by Darth Spoon, 06 October 2006 - 01:56 AM.


#55
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Get your own ****ing thread!

Jackass!

#56
Darth Spoon

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Funny, last time I looked ST discussion was welcome in here. Oh well, bite me anyway...

Edited by Darth Spoon, 06 October 2006 - 03:21 AM.


#57
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[quote name='Darth Ralph Wiggum' date='1 Oct 2006, 11:21 AM' post='1318877']
I have to disagree. The films didn't change the characters.

The plotline for Data's emotion chip was straight out of the series[/quote]

But the execution of the emotion chip plot was what I had a problem with. It reduced Data to comic releif, and I didn't like that.



[quote]Picard was an action hero in the series. Lest you forget him kicking the crap out of people a fair bit in the series[img].[/quote]

Yeah, but in the movies, he came off as cheesey, to me for some reason, especially referring to Insurrection.

[quote]The rest is just conjecture.[/quote]

The rest was exageration, with some truth to it. :)


[quote]
I find it amazing that you can say 'oh no I do like the series' but tear the crap out of it in the next sentence.[quote]

Where did I rip the TNG tv series? I was commenting on the fact that the TNG movies were sub par compared to the series. Maybe I come of as too harsh. The fact of the matter is that I liked all the TNG movies as movies. I have them all on DVD and on rare occasions, I still watch them. But relative to the TNG series, there was elements I didn't like in them.



[quote]Next thing, people will be telling me that they weren't wowed at the cinema by Generations and First Contact when they came out.

Because I know you were.[/quote]

FC, yes. I loved it when it first came out. Generations....well yes and no. Yes on the FX. No on how they killed kirk, blew up the Enterprise-D, in my view, ruined data's character in my view, and had the TNG cast flip flopping from TNG to DS9/VOY uniforms, and back. I remember leaving the theater feeling let down.


[quote]
Fair enough Insurrection was a little slow paced, but I thought Nemesis was a pretty good film.

You guys are talking about the Next Gen cast like I talk about Voyager. I'm just not feeling the love here.
[/quote]


Insurrection would have been a great tv episode. It wasn't a bad movie, either. It just wasn't a great movie. Partly because it followed FC.

I never have bashed the TNG series. I am just saying compared to the series, the TNG movies just didnt have same feel for me. I can't exactly put my finger on it, it just did. But also, the movies are not bad movies. I just had high (maybe unrealisticly high) expectations. Or maybe it's just seeing the TNG show on TV for free, and then paying $12 to see a glorified 2 hour episode. I dunno.

#58
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I always felt the problem with THG movies was the timing.

TOS had been off the air for years when TMP came out. We saw characters that we loved dramatically changed and in situations (personal and professional) that we had not seen them before.

Generations was just too close on the heals of All Good Things... and it seamed that change in the characters was forced (emotion chip problems... etc...)

FC was good because it was totally different than most of the series and put a few different characters in different situations.

Ins... all it did was hook Riker and Troy back up.... that and come off as a ok series episode

Nem was just a poor rehash of TWOK and not a well executed one.

#59
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I personally would love to see Data come back and his resurrection can be done easily through the power of the Q

#60
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I personally would love to see Data come back and his resurrection can be done easily through the power of the Q


Welcome to Nightly dimitrist :)

#61
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nightly = denial

#62
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nightly = denial


You've lost me? Were you referring to your sig cause if you were: I get it.

#63
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haha.. sorta...

I just meant that he was in a bit of denial if he thought Data was coming back

#64
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DS9's story (except Sisko himself) and Voyager's story ended with the last episode, and TOS should have ended with XI.

DS9's not over yet, they didn't join the Federation until the books. Who takes over DS9 since Sisko's gone? The Federation would have sent another officer to oversee the place - or, if you do like the books, Kira gets a Starfleet commission as Commander and takes over. (With Ro Laren as her security chief, which is so awesome although the meeting between Laren and Picard in the books sucked)

I'm still waiting for a DS9 movie.


Ah me too, me too.

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#65
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Again-- DENIAL!

A DS9 movie will never happen. When it comes to Trek films it is very important that they appeal to a wide audience. The cross-over ticket sales are needed. That's why Trek films tend to be stand alone broad strokes, and not the subtle fan-appealing stories.

DS9 is more of a fan favorite show with cult-like status. It was never the pop-culture hit TNG and TOS were. For them to do a movie, to explain what happened to Sisko, and bring him back in a stand alone wfilm would be nearly impossible to do.

At least that's the logic the studios have. They don't get that if they made it for fans, fans wpould go repeatedly. IF you look at the top 3 Trek films (TWOK, TVH and First Contact) two of them continue storylines from their respective series.

#66
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How do you feel about what I said Tank? Would you like to see them scrap this 'TOS - The Wonder Years Revisited' idea for XI and have them write a script to bring back Data or do you think it's a lame idea from an android fanboi?

I'd like to see it in keeping with established storylines.

BTW: I don't know if I've been clear already. I want the story to be based around bringing Data back and not just another film where he's excused into the cast early on and a rag-tag story thrown in on the end.

#67
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Personally, I don't think it's a bad idea. Data was certainly always one of my favorite characters. But I don't know if he would be central enough to warrant a devoted film storyline. Plus, his death movie was seen as such a rip-off of Wrath of Kahn, a response like that would surely be seen as a rip off of The Search for Spock. It could easily be a secondary storyline though-- given that all of the TNG films seem to focus on him in B stories anyway.

That said, I think that they should let sleeping dogs lie. I am in the camp of Trek NEEDING a rest. I don't think the TNG cast has mileage anymore. If Paramount wanted to stay in the 24th century I always thought it would be good to make a film cast that makes use of a mix of all the 24 century shows (TNG, DS9 and VOY). But even that idea seems a little tired.

MY fanboi idea, if they put me in charge, would be to do what Gene did with TNG, or what Grant Morrison did with the X-Men. Take the combined history of all Trek, respect it, revere it, then move as far away from it as possible. Use it as a common knowledge base, but go in a new direction. I'd jump ahead into the future-- past anything the BEEBS did with their stupid temporal war / time ship nonesense, and start fresh. 30th century. Everying new is old, everything old is new. Vulcans, Klingons, Humans, etc- all there, but completely different for reasons to be explored later.

I'm not sure how I feel about what Abrahms is doing with a TOS story, but I can see why it is the safest bet for Paramount. It fits the NEW but OLD paradigm that the franchise needs. I really think that while they say they are respecting continuity, we might be seeing a relaunch.

Batman Begins was produced the same way. It COULD have easily been a prequel to the Burton/Schumacher films, and if it bombed, it would likely have been packaged that way. But it clearly set itself apart early in production as spoilers got out, and quickly evolved into it's own continuity. If Abrahms films does so so-- it's just ne of the continuing adventures. But if it is a HUGE hit, it's going to be the starting point of a revised franchise.

#68
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Quite similar to the new James Bond then.

Old but refreshingly new!

I'd definately prefer your approach to a rest then a new direction complete with nostalgia. I'd like ST to return to TV sometime in the future like Doctor Who has. I don't like Doctor Who personally, but as an observer I do think the franchise has benefitted from a rest.

#69
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New news about Star Trek XI - the script is finished and we get some clarification about the movie's overall story. I'm still completely convinced with the 'pre-TOS' adventures angle will work out - but it looks like the 'adventures with school' angle was just rumor or passed over. Either way it's starting to sound like the movie could turn out decently.

http://www.comingsoo...ws.php?id=18367

Abrams and Shatner on Star Trek XI
Source: Entertainment Weekly, SCI FI Wire
January 11, 2007


Both J.J. Abrams and William Shatner have been talking about Star Trek XI, targeted for a 2008 release. Abrams ("Lost," Mission: Impossible III) confirmed to Entertainment Weekly that the script is done, and it will be trimmed sometime soon.

Abrams said it's a story that even non-Trekkers can enjoy. "On the one hand, for people who love Star Trek, the fix that they will get will be really satisfying," he said. "For people who've never seen it or know it vaguely, I think they will enjoy it equally, because the movie does not require you to know anything about Star Trek. I would actually prefer [that]people don't know the series, because I feel like they will come to it with an open mind."

Meanwhile, SCI FI Wire caught up with William Shatner, who says the 11th movie will indeed deal with the early years of Capt. James T. Kirk and Spock - and that he will definitely appear in the movie if director J.J. Abrams can find a place to use him. Shatner, who originated the role of Kirk in the original Trek series and several subsequent films, said in the interview that he was invited to meet with Abrams.

"I met with J.J., and they told me they would like me to be part of their film, but they have to write the role," Shatner said. And confirming the rumors, Shatner added, "Yes, we know the story is based on young Kirk."



#70
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THis sounds cool. However, i'm a little sceptical about Shatner appearinng in the film for the sake of appearing. THis could easily come off as looking incredibly silly and comploetely uneccesary.

#71
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It's probably Kirk and Spock sitting around saying HAY REMEMBER THE TIME WHEN WE MET, and the flashback is the movie.

#72
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The movie as a flashback is an interesting idea - not sure how one would 'place' present-Kirk and present-Spock though.

#73
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Pre- Enterprise B launch would be the only way, even though the SHAT has aged considerably since then.

I supposed they could do a 24th century Spock watching a holodeck recreation-- but that smacks of tired B&B tropes (see the last episode of Enterprise).

Shat could always play Kirk's father.

Or maybe it is a ressurection story for Kirk. Something 24th century Spock does to bring Kirk back, and involves examining how they met?

i dunno, any way you cut it it seems kinda hackneyed.

#74
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They better come back to resurrect Data that's all I'm saying!!!

#75
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They pretty much did. The producers realized hey had ruined Data by giving him emotions, so they transferred his brains into B4, who can now technically be Data, played by the same actor, but have the emotionless pinocchio qualities Data had in seasons 1-3.